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 Expectations!
Topic Originator: renegade master  
Date:   Wed 9 Jan 22:43

Ok we will or maybe not have new manager soon enough.

What should a realistic expectation for them be this season?

1. regroup, maintain Championship Status?
2. Must get us into the play offs?
3, Doesn't matter this season is written of due to AJ what will be will be?
4. I expect the new manager to be totally ruthless position doesn't matter he gets players, team playing and offloads the passengers in the squad?
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 Re: Expectations!
Topic Originator: Stanza  
Date:   Wed 9 Jan 22:47

How, contractually, does a manager "offload the passengers in the squad"?

If they are really that bad, why should any other club think it worth buying out the remainder of their contract(s)?

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 Re: Expectations!
Topic Originator: renegade master  
Date:   Wed 9 Jan 22:49

Mutually agree contract termination as Dundee and Falkirk seem to be doing everyday at the moment!
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 Re: Expectations!
Topic Originator: rossmcno1  
Date:   Wed 9 Jan 22:52

Doesn’t come for free.



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 Re: Expectations!
Topic Originator: KirklistonPar  
Date:   Wed 9 Jan 22:53

I’d be expecting him to keep us up, nothing else. This season has been a disappointment after last season & a few players need sold & replaced. Not the best time of the season to be buying players so I would expect him to get to know the squad & start to build for next season. I love a wee mid season turn a round mirrical though, the play off games were brilliant entertainment last season.
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 Re: Expectations!
Topic Originator: incognito  
Date:   Wed 9 Jan 23:09

I’d be expecting playoffs and I’m sure the board will be expecting nothing less! We are 4 points from the play offs and people saying the the season is over? Pre Madonna’s!!
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 Re: Expectations!
Topic Originator: Never10yairds  
Date:   Wed 9 Jan 23:22

Keep us up this year and start to build a foundation to push for promotion next year. They will need the pre season to shape the side to their own designs.
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 Re: Expectations!
Topic Originator: GG Riva  
Date:   Thu 10 Jan 06:35

There's no reason the new manager should not target a play off place, but equally, he can't be deemed to have failed if he doesn't achieve that.

I'm not complacent about relegation, but I think there's enough quality in the squad for us to steer well clear of it, whoever the new manager is. I also don't believe we'd have gone down with AJ.

The only thing that could derail us is fear. Sometimes teams who are drawn in to a dogfight become paralysed by fear and one defeat leads to another.....



Not your average Sunday League player.
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 Re: Expectations!
Topic Originator: Sliema Par  
Date:   Thu 10 Jan 06:43

It is enticing ,but simplistic ,to argue that ,because we consistently have bigger Gates than half the Premiership, we should be upsides with Kilmarnock,St Johnstone,Motherwell etc or ,for heavens sake, Livingston.

The fact remains that fourth bottom of the Championship is NOT acceptable.

I would expect the new Manager to assess the squad though a five year old could see where the blatant weakness lies(send for a five year old-Groucho Marx).

Just keep us safe and mid table for the moment ,but next season there can be no doubting the aim.The Premiership Play Offs at a bare minimum.

The likes of Alan Archibald or Jim Duffy would achieve that.Maybe Jim Goodwin would ,though I doubt we would enjoy the 0-1-9 system.
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 Re: Expectations!
Topic Originator: Clarko  
Date:   Thu 10 Jan 08:16

“Pre Madonna’s”... Lol..!
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 Re: Expectations!
Topic Originator: sonofpetrie  
Date:   Thu 10 Jan 08:20

Quote:

incognito, Wed 9 Jan 23:09

I’d be expecting playoffs and I’m sure the board will be expecting nothing less! We are 4 points from the play offs and people saying the the season is over? Pre Madonna’s!!


I can't remember a world "Pre Madonna" or Pre Cyndi Lauper for that matter.

"The only place success comes before work is in the dictionary"
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 Re: Expectations!
Topic Originator: GEW35  
Date:   Thu 10 Jan 08:37

Quote:

Sliema Par, Thu 10 Jan 06:43

It is enticing ,but simplistic ,to argue that ,because we consistently have bigger Gates than half the Premiership, we should be upsides with Kilmarnock,St Johnstone,Motherwell etc or ,for heavens sake, Livingston.

The fact remains that fourth bottom of the Championship is NOT acceptable.

I would expect the new Manager to assess the squad though a five year old could see where the blatant weakness lies(send for a five year old-Groucho Marx).

Just keep us safe and mid table for the moment ,but next season there can be no doubting the aim.The Premiership Play Offs at a bare minimum.

The likes of Alan Archibald or Jim Duffy would achieve that.Maybe Jim Goodwin would ,though I doubt we would enjoy the 0-1-9 system.


What’s with the constant adoration of Jim Duffy? Just because he comes over on radio and tv as a nice chap, and I’m sure he is, it doesn’t mean he’s an attractive proposition for us. He’s hardly set the heather alight at the clubs he’s managed/coached and fans have been glad to see the back of him. If you seriously think he’d improve the Pars then I worry for you! You must be related to him I’m thinking.....
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 Re: Expectations!
Topic Originator: Jeffery  
Date:   Thu 10 Jan 08:44

I would like a permanent manager now and I would be happy with any kind, if even slight, improvement in the rest of this season.

Getting someone in now would give the new manager two transfer windows and the remainder of this season to assess the squad before next season.
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 Re: Expectations!
Topic Originator: Tenruh  
Date:   Thu 10 Jan 08:47

Quote:

Jeffery, Thu 10 Jan 08:44

I would like a permanent manager now and I would be happy with any kind, if even slight, improvement in the rest of this season.

Getting someone in now would give the new manager two transfer windows and the remainder of this season to assess the squad before next season.


This
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 Re: Expectations!
Topic Originator: Rastapari  
Date:   Thu 10 Jan 08:50

Quote:

renegade master, Wed 9 Jan 22:49

Mutually agree contract termination as Dundee and Falkirk seem to be doing everyday at the moment!


You know that they have to be paid right?

I Hope You're Ok Today....
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 Re: Expectations!
Topic Originator: londonparsfan  
Date:   Thu 10 Jan 08:50

'There's no reason the new manager should not target a play off place, but equally, he can't be deemed to have failed if he doesn't achieve that.

I'm not complacent about relegation, but I think there's enough quality in the squad for us to steer well clear of it, whoever the new manager is. I also don't believe we'd have gone down with AJ.'

And also 100% this.
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 Re: Expectations!
Topic Originator: renegade master  
Date:   Thu 10 Jan 09:15

Topic Originator: Rastapari like | nolike
Date: Thu 10 Jan 08:50

Quote:

renegade master, Wed 9 Jan 22:49

Mutually agree contract termination as Dundee and Falkirk seem to be doing everyday at the moment!


You know that they have to be paid right?

I Hope You're Ok Today....

Rastapari.

Not always the case my friend. If a player wants to leave for whatever reason the term mutually agreed comes into play. You have situations where players know they won't get a game so may wish to drop a level or 2 to get game time, kickstart their career or take advantage of a pre contract offer.

In some cases new clubs will buy out the remaining time of the contract to allow for release as in some cases will the player himself all depends on circumstances other times it might just be a token amount.

Again this is where agents can become a pain or a bonus!



Post Edited (Thu 10 Jan 09:16)
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 Re: Expectations!
Topic Originator: londonparsfan  
Date:   Thu 10 Jan 09:18

All of that's true but more often than not it's the club doing the realising that coughs up the cash.
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 Re: Expectations!
Topic Originator: mach1  
Date:   Thu 10 Jan 09:22

My expectations for the rest of this season are very simple.
I just want to see some good football allied to effort and determination to get as high as we can.

If we do reach playoffs that would now be a bonus, but changes in performance levels will help keep fans we have and hopefully attract new ones.
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 Re: Expectations!
Topic Originator: JimMcDAFC  
Date:   Thu 10 Jan 09:23

I don't want us to rush into appointing a new manager. I would rather they took their time and get the manager they want even if that's end of the season providing Steve does not take us on a downward spiral. Avoid diceing with relegation and if we can make the play-off spot that would be a bonus.
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 Re: Expectations!
Topic Originator: eastendalloapar  
Date:   Thu 10 Jan 09:23

As there would be quite a few that a new manager might want to get rid of, it might be easier to keep them and utilise them as subs or reserves and then see where we end up at the end of the season.

matt forsyth
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 Re: Expectations!
Topic Originator: Rastapari  
Date:   Thu 10 Jan 09:24

Quote:

renegade master, Thu 10 Jan 09:15

Topic Originator: Rastapari like | nolike
Date: Thu 10 Jan 08:50

Quote:

renegade master, Wed 9 Jan 22:49

Mutually agree contract termination as Dundee and Falkirk seem to be doing everyday at the moment!


You know that they have to be paid right?

I Hope You're Ok Today....

Rastapari.

Not always the case my friend. If a player wants to leave for whatever reason the term mutually agreed comes into play. You have situations where players know they won't get a game so may wish to drop a level or 2 to get game time, kickstart their career or take advantage of a pre contract offer.

In some cases new clubs will buy out the remaining time of the contract to allow for release as in some cases will the player himself all depends on circumstances other times it might just be a token amount.

Again this is where agents can become a pain or a bonus!


Hmmmm, not sure any of the garbage we'd be trying to offload is going to inspire a club to get the cash out.
And the names being bandied about for manager, well, let's just say I thought those who were baying loudest for AJ to go would have had more ambition than other managers who have failed at this level or ex players based on sentiment.

I Hope You're Ok Today....
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 Re: Expectations!
Topic Originator: renegade master  
Date:   Thu 10 Jan 09:30

You would hope however LPF if a player is told "you are not part of my plans and you are free to find a new club" would leave many footballers alerting their agents asap to find me a new club now or risk joining the 100's that are released every May.

By which time they have had no game time and are left having to trial here there and everywhere looking to win a contract alongside everyone else?

In the short term they can instruct their agent to alert clubs now that the player is available now with no fee involved and agree a contract to hopefully stop them becoming a free agent in May.

Long term security over short term gain?

Yes I appreciate those on 2 year deals maybe happy to sit and collect a wage but as a footballer why would you, at this level you want to play football not train all week to sit in the stands knowing you won't get a game.
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 Re: Expectations!
Topic Originator: Rastapari  
Date:   Thu 10 Jan 09:58

Quote:

renegade master, Thu 10 Jan 09:30

You would hope however LPF if a player is told "you are not part of my plans and you are free to find a new club" would leave many footballers alerting their agents asap to find me a new club now or risk joining the 100's that are released every May.

By which time they have had no game time and are left having to trial here there and everywhere looking to win a contract alongside everyone else?

In the short term they can instruct their agent to alert clubs now that the player is available now with no fee involved and agree a contract to hopefully stop them becoming a free agent in May.

Long term security over short term gain?

Yes I appreciate those on 2 year deals maybe happy to sit and collect a wage but as a footballer why would you, at this level you want to play football not train all week to sit in the stands knowing you won't get a game.


No doubt a couple would see it that way, hope so, we'll just have to wait and see...

I Hope You're Ok Today....
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 Re: Expectations!
Topic Originator: P  
Date:   Thu 10 Jan 10:02

"You would hope however LPF if a player is told "you are not part of my plans and you are free to find a new club" would leave many footballers alerting their agents asap to find me a new club now or risk joining the 100's that are released every May."

Players leaving in May can sign a pre contract now anyway so they don't need to leave and look for a club. They can (and probably are) look already and IF they got a club and IF that club wanted them early then yes they would go but otherwise they will maintain the security of a regular wage.
Problem is our players have underperformed so will likely only be moving down and earning less so can't imagine any would be in a rush to do so. Also, maybe they will want to try and impress the new manager and try and salvage their career
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 Re: Expectations!
Topic Originator: Rastapari  
Date:   Thu 10 Jan 10:17

Expectations....ok I'll put it out there...we want to improve on AJ right?
Play offs or promotion or it's been an expensive waste of time.

I Hope You're Ok Today....
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 Re: Expectations!
Topic Originator: Stanza  
Date:   Thu 10 Jan 11:24

Quote:

Rastapari, Thu 10 Jan 10:17

Expectations....ok I'll put it out there...we want to improve on AJ right?
Play offs or promotion or it's been an expensive waste of time.


This.

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 Re: Expectations!
Topic Originator: londonparsfan  
Date:   Thu 10 Jan 11:29

Quote:

P, Thu 10 Jan 10:02

"You would hope however LPF if a player is told "you are not part of my plans and you are free to find a new club" would leave many footballers alerting their agents asap to find me a new club now or risk joining the 100's that are released every May."

Players leaving in May can sign a pre contract now anyway so they don't need to leave and look for a club. They can (and probably are) look already and IF they got a club and IF that club wanted them early then yes they would go but otherwise they will maintain the security of a regular wage.
Problem is our players have underperformed so will likely only be moving down and earning less so can't imagine any would be in a rush to do so. Also, maybe they will want to try and impress the new manager and try and salvage their career


I would have said this but probably not as well as P.
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 Re: Expectations!
Topic Originator: BlackLight  
Date:   Thu 10 Jan 12:53


I see a simple interview question for any potential manager...

What role should Myles Hippolyte play?

If the answer is anything other than 'Sammy The Tammy's stand in' he or she doesn't get the job.
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 Re: Expectations!
Topic Originator: Boston Red Sox  
Date:   Thu 10 Jan 13:26

Quote:

Rastapari, Thu 10 Jan 10:17

Expectations....ok I'll put it out there...we want to improve on AJ right?
Play offs or promotion or it's been an expensive waste of time.


Pretty much this⬆️


Same rules apply
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 Re: Expectations!
Topic Originator: eastendalloapar  
Date:   Thu 10 Jan 13:44

The play offs. Nothing less.

matt forsyth
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 Re: Expectations!
Topic Originator: Raymie the Legend  
Date:   Thu 10 Jan 13:48

Absolutely, the play-offs. This squad is underachieving, IMO




It's bloody tough being a legend
Ron Atkinson - 1983
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 Re: Expectations!
Topic Originator: dafc  
Date:   Thu 10 Jan 13:48

With this current squad the expectations should be top 4 and a play off place, anything other is a failure of the new manager.
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 Re: Expectations!
Topic Originator: elvis_lives  
Date:   Thu 10 Jan 13:48

This season? Avoid the bottom two.


Surely a new manager needs a couple of months to assess and then a summer transfer window to build his own team.
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 Re: Expectations!
Topic Originator: Yasser76  
Date:   Thu 10 Jan 13:55

If the expectation is just for the new manager to be better than the last, according to this, it might be more of a challenge than expected!


Allan Johnston 08 May 2015 - 09 Jan 2019 Won: 79, Drawn: 44, Lost: 45

Jim Jefferies 20 Mar 2012 - 19 Dec 2014 Won: 54, Drawn: 22, Lost: 48

Jim McIntyre 04 Dec 2007 - 16 Mar 2012 Won: 77, Drawn: 53, Lost: 65

Stephen Kenny 13 Nov 2006 - 04 Dec 2007 Won: 16, Drawn: 11, Lost: 24

Jim Leishman 03 May 2005 - 26 Oct 2006 Won: 16, Drawn: 12, Lost: 32

David Hay 01 Jul 2004 - 30 May 2005 Won: 8, Drawn: 12, Lost: 22

Jimmy Calderwood 30 Nov 1999 - 28 May 2004 Won: 77, Drawn: 47, Lost: 78

Dick Campbell 05 Jan 1999 - 02 Nov 1999 Won: 9, Drawn: 11, Lost: 11

Jocky Scott 23 Sep 1991 - 31 May 1993 Won: 2, Drawn: 2, Lost: 4

Iain Munro 01 Aug 1990 - 23 Sep 1991 Won: 11, Drawn: 12, Lost: 19

Jim Leishman 01 Aug 1983 - 31 May 1990 Won: 128, Drawn: 77, Lost: 97

Jock Stein 01 Mar 1960 - 01 Mar 1965 Won: 93, Drawn: 37, Lost: 62

https://www.thesackrace.com/teams/dunfermline-athletic



PS

Post Edited (Thu 10 Jan 13:57)
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 Re: Expectations!
Topic Originator: GJS93  
Date:   Thu 10 Jan 14:28

"This season? Avoid the bottom two.

Surely a new manager needs a couple of months to assess and then a summer transfer window to build his own team"

that is why the change should have happened back in November, avoiding the bottom two the only priority now.

"Expectations....ok I'll put it out there...we want to improve on AJ right?
Play offs or promotion or it's been an expensive waste of time"

no pressure then....
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 Re: Expectations!
Topic Originator: Rastapari  
Date:   Thu 10 Jan 14:30

Quote:

GJS93, Thu 10 Jan 14:28

"This season? Avoid the bottom two.

Surely a new manager needs a couple of months to assess and then a summer transfer window to build his own team"

that is why the change should have happened back in November, avoiding the bottom two the only priority now.

"Expectations....ok I'll put it out there...we want to improve on AJ right?
Play offs or promotion or it's been an expensive waste of time"

no pressure then....


If he has a spine, none at all, we want to improve, not go backwards whilst the new boy gets comfy.

I Hope You're Ok Today....
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 Re: Expectations!
Topic Originator: evo!  
Date:   Thu 10 Jan 15:53

I'd say spend the third quarter building or maintaining the gap with teams below, rule out play off/relegation threat while keeping us no further back from the top 4 than now. Then go for the promotion play offs..you wanna take a late run of momentum into them..though admittedly it didn't get us through them last year

Jobby!
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 Re: Expectations!
Topic Originator: McCaig`s Tower  
Date:   Thu 10 Jan 20:22

I thought this might be about expectations in general, not in this specific context, so I’ll comment on both.

Looking at the last 50 years, we have spent 21 seasons in the top tier, 20 in the second (not including this one) and 9 in the third tier. Our mean position is 15.6th (i.e. between 3rd and 4th in tier 2, as currently constructed). We have had 10 relegations and 9 promotions. More than half the time we have finished within a couple of places of the previous season (which is not a surprise given the divisions are so small).

Obviously there are ebbs and flow over the years, but If the last half century is a guide, life as a Pars fan is to witness a cycle of being on the fringes of promotion campaigns, getting close to it, achieving it, having a couple of safe years, before flirting with and eventually succumbing to relegation again. There is the occasional disaster of a season, which can take several years to recover from.

Having finished 4th last year (which was looking unlikely latterly) we might reasonably have expected to finish between 2nd and 6th this campaign. You would have hoped we were on an upswing, but with some clubs with bigger budgets (ICT, Ross County, Dundee Utd and Partick, one might guess) it was never going to be easy. Mind you, two one-goal swings in the last 2 games, and we would be in fourth. Essentially I’m arguing that in historical terms any underperformance is relatively slight – I think it is more the manner of the underperformance that has been troubling.

As for expectations of the new management team:

I’ve no idea if they will be given any money (I suspect any cash earmarked for trading in the transfer window may have to go towards any pay-off due (and I wouldn’t be surprised if the board have had to dig into their own pockets)), but I’ll assume not. It shouldn’t matter – they have plenty of good players to choose from.

I think promotion is gone for this year; the play-offs are eminently possible (and bizarrely may generate a feel-good feeling that wouldn’t normally be associated with a fairly average season). I’d settle for encouraging signs (and a few goals). Longer term – I’d expect the foundations to be laid for year on year improvement and promotion.

It’s a fair comment to suggest that if they were going to settle for avoiding relegation there was little point in making the change. (And to say that it should have been made in November). I think the board has made errors; the key thing is not to compound things by trying to save face.

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 Re: Expectations!
Topic Originator: average white par  
Date:   Thu 10 Jan 20:41

"Pre Madonnas"

This is truly quite superb...

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 Re: Expectations!
Topic Originator: elvis_lives  
Date:   Thu 10 Jan 22:21

Quote:

Rastapari, Thu 10 Jan 10:17

Expectations....ok I'll put it out there...we want to improve on AJ right?
Play offs or promotion or it's been an expensive waste of time.


Might have misunderstood but thought you said a few posts back we had duds that nobody wanted.

How can the new manager get that kind of immediate success with duds nobody wants?
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 Re: Expectations!
Topic Originator: Rastapari  
Date:   Thu 10 Jan 22:24

Quote:

elvis_lives, Thu 10 Jan 22:21

Quote:

Rastapari, Thu 10 Jan 10:17

Expectations....ok I'll put it out there...we want to improve on AJ right?
Play offs or promotion or it's been an expensive waste of time.


Might have misunderstood but thought you said a few posts back we had duds that nobody wanted.

How can the new manager get that kind of immediate success with duds nobody wants?


Because he's better than the last guy....hardly rocket science.
Falkirk had a squad of absolute crap, their new manager managed to eek out a few results from them, because he is better than the last guy.
And I didn't say they were duds, I said there would be few takers if it involved any pay out.

I Hope You're Ok Today....
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 Re: Expectations!
Topic Originator: elvis_lives  
Date:   Thu 10 Jan 22:42

In your opinion is anything less than fourth this season a failure?
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 Re: Expectations!
Topic Originator: Rastapari  
Date:   Thu 10 Jan 22:50

Quote:

elvis_lives, Thu 10 Jan 22:42

In your opinion is anything less than fourth this season a failure?


No, you're trying to be cute there, I stated quite clearly if the new manager (at the time not announced) could not improve on where we are and maje the play offs it is could an expensive waste, given the play offs were the target.
Are you saying we should not expect improvement?

I Hope You're Ok Today....

Post Edited (Thu 10 Jan 22:51)
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 Re: Expectations!
Topic Originator: Grant  
Date:   Thu 10 Jan 22:57

But then Rasta there's absolutely no way of knowing where AJ would have taken us, he could have had us in eigth or he could have had us in fourth. How do you define improvement?
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 Re: Expectations!
Topic Originator: Rastapari  
Date:   Thu 10 Jan 23:09

Quote:

Grant, Thu 10 Jan 22:57

But then Rasta there's absolutely no way of knowing where AJ would have taken us, he could have had us in eigth or he could have had us in fourth. How do you define improvement?


Better than the last guy, like I said, hardly rocket science. We want the new guy to be better than the last guy, simple concept.

I Hope You're Ok Today....
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 Re: Expectations!
Topic Originator: Grant  
Date:   Fri 11 Jan 00:08

So finishing in 6th will do?
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 Re: Expectations!
Topic Originator: Rastapari  
Date:   Fri 11 Jan 08:17

Quote:

Grant, Fri 11 Jan 00:08

So finishing in 6th will do?


I've stated already what I think, if you'd read it you'd know, you're trying to put words in my mouth but you're not particularly good at it.
Bye.

I Hope You're Ok Today....
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