DAFC.net
Home 22 April 2019 
 Post Message  |  Top of Board  |  Go to Topic  |  Search  |  Twitter Updates  |  Log In   Forum Rules  |  Newer Topic  |  Older Topic  |  end 
[ please login to use the Like feature ]
 The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: PARrot  
Date:   Sun 14 Apr 12:35

I suppose football players know what they are letting themselves in for when they sign up. Most of them are fans of other clubs too, and maybe they can be just as critical as us.

Great players will get pelters when they have a bad day or make a horrendous blunder but they get plenty praise to balance it out. Players at our level are not crapp. They are plying their trade at a decent level but it is a level where there are plent equals. It isnt easy shining against equals. You kinda cancel each other out and subsequently prevent each other from shining.

Im sure our players are big enough to take the criticism along with praise when it comes but does it have to be so cutting.
We are all intelligent people. I am pretty sure we can find ways to express disappointment and even vent, without verbally assassinating guys who are most likely hurting as much as we are.
We all get just criticism when we under perform at work but there are guidlines and laws that prevent abuse. I cant think on any other profession where employees are openly subjected to so much abuse for so little reward. Different for high earning players maybe.

[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: theparsman1885  
Date:   Sun 14 Apr 12:41

Aye very good you’re the better man eh. Any wonder you’re called parrot, same Keich on repeat.

How about this. Those players take good wages from our pockets via the club. They are happy to get the plaudits on social media when it’s going well, but reality is the vast majority of them downed tools yesterday. Falkirk wanted it more, those imposters didn’t. That might be acceptable to you and your low standards/expectations, but the minimum I expect is a shift. So many of them yesterday and for large parts of the season haven’t even given us that.

Do I condone abuse? No. But the players and all those associated with the club need to realise that if they underperform then they will be told! And quite right too. How dare they wear that jersey, take our money and play with such poor effort like that?!

Beaten by a far worse team who simply worked harder.
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: PARrot  
Date:   Sun 14 Apr 12:51

Nothing to do with being the better guy.
Just a reflection.

Yes they should be told. Im just saying or asking, does it need to be so toxic?

I dont think they didnt put in a shift. They were the width of the bar and the post from winning and if they had....this forum would be in a completely polar frame of mind. They failed...for that they get just criticism but do they really deserve arsenic.

Im sure you are a nice guy really.



Post Edited (Sun 14 Apr 13:11)
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: Sliema Par  
Date:   Sun 14 Apr 13:28

The OP is spot on.

The attacks on two of our experienced players yesterday are over the top.

And to hear young Todd being criticised beggars belief.
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: Par  
Date:   Sun 14 Apr 13:28

I bet none of the players are feeling as bad as the fans after yesterdays farce. Big clear out in the summer and get some players with balls in.
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: SergioDuarte  
Date:   Sun 14 Apr 14:08

The players don’t give a feck min.
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: PARrot  
Date:   Sun 14 Apr 14:43

Quote:

SergioDuarte, Sun 14 Apr 14:08

The players don’t give a feck min.


That is maybe how you feel and it is important that players know how fans feel. I wouldn't call your comment over the top. Doesnt mean it is true but it is how you feel.
Adequately voiced.

[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: DAFC_90  
Date:   Sun 14 Apr 14:50

The players will care to some extent as they'll lose there win bonus.
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: PARrot  
Date:   Sun 14 Apr 14:59

Honestly I think most if not all of them really do care. They might not show it when getting booed or verbally abused but no footballer likes letting the fans down.

[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: GG Riva  
Date:   Sun 14 Apr 15:14

Quote:

SergioDuarte, Sun 14 Apr 14:08

The players don’t give a feck min.


We can only speak for ourselves, Sergio. Many fans were raging at full time and will be hurting for a long time. It would have been easier to take if we'd lost to a decent side, but Falkirk are as poor a team as I've seen in this league.

What I do know from working with the players is that the two things they hate the most in football is being injured and losing. Most of them say being injured is marginally worse because you can't affect the result of a game that's going against your team.

So yes, they do give a feck, but probably get over it much sooner than us fans. Monday morning, go over a video of the game, highlight any good play and mistakes made and then start training and looking ahead to the next game.



Not your average Sunday League player.
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: PARrot  
Date:   Sun 14 Apr 15:23

They certainly don't like getting booed or abused. They don't deliberately fail to attract such attention.
Losing affects prospects of decent contracts in a career that doesn't last long. Every defeat is a reduction in their value.
Losing hurts them and fans turning on them hurts them. I think it is being disingenious saying they don't care.

[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: KirklistonPar  
Date:   Sun 14 Apr 15:55

Everyone who plays, supports and works for club cares.
Football isn’t just a job it’s a passion.
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: RossDAFC  
Date:   Sun 14 Apr 16:03

I respect some of the unwaivering positivity from some of the posters but some people need a reality check. Said before and will say again, we pay these players wages and in return expect at the very least a decent effort from each individual that pulls on the strip. That was easily one of the most lifeless, pathetic performances from a Dunfermline team in a very long time. There is not getting results, then there is not giving 100%. No point in trying to wrap the boys in cotton wool every single poor performance they give us. We shall see the impact that this spinelessness has on fans renewing season tickets etc.
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: richie5401  
Date:   Sun 14 Apr 16:11

The praise/criticism dynamic is nearly always out of balance.Might be 30/70 over any period of time.
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: DAFC_90  
Date:   Sun 14 Apr 16:21

A bit over the top to say it's the worst performance, we've played worse and created less chances and won games



Post Edited (Sun 14 Apr 16:32)
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: PARrot  
Date:   Sun 14 Apr 16:52

Quote:

RossDAFC, Sun 14 Apr 16:03

I respect some of the unwaivering positivity from some of the posters but some people need a reality check. Said before and will say again, we pay these players wages and in return expect at the very least a decent effort from each individual that pulls on the strip. That was easily one of the most lifeless, pathetic performances from a Dunfermline team in a very long time. There is not getting results, then there is not giving 100%. No point in trying to wrap the boys in cotton wool every single poor performance they give us. We shall see the impact that this spinelessness has on fans renewing season tickets etc.


Fair post until you got to spineless. Not true and no need.

[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: PARrot  
Date:   Sun 14 Apr 16:52

Quote:

DAFC_90, Sun 14 Apr 16:21

A bit over the top to say it's the worst performance, we've played worse and created less chances and won games


You can actually be awrite sometimes 😉😜

[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: RossDAFC  
Date:   Sun 14 Apr 19:00

Care to explain who showed yesterday that they cared? Absolutely nobody. If you cannot see that then i’m afraid it is your judgement that is impaired.
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: Berkey  
Date:   Sun 14 Apr 19:22

Spineless is the exact words I would use to describe Blair yesterday, he shat the bed in even the 80-20 challenges in his favour. It was embarrassing.

Fair enough if they were better, but to be scared to compete with them is just not on. If that game mattered to him he hid it well.

Prey to god we don’t sign him up for next year, we need men in this team.



Just sitting here drenched in my own positivity! AJ is gone!

Post Edited (Sun 14 Apr 19:23)
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: Bucuresti Par  
Date:   Sun 14 Apr 19:43

Watching from Pars TV (great as it is having a chance to see each game) doesn't give you a full sense of the game, the atmosphere, the conditions etc
But from what I have seen, I think most of the players do care (except Muirhead), yesterday and indeed this season I don't think there was a lack of effort, simply a lack of quality. They don't care as much as any fan and is very frustrating to lose to such a useless Falkirk team twice at EEP. We also don't have a player in the team that has been at the club for a few years and outwardly shows a strong affection for the club, which probably adds to this perception that they all don't care.

Some of the players are simply not good enough, some are too light weight, some are simply a bad fit at EEP. Having most of them out of contract should help SC better a balanced squad and hopefully also with more quality.
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: yorkiepar  
Date:   Sun 14 Apr 19:55

Reading the many posts on the subject of of individual players and their respective merits / demerits - at least from the point of view of the "experts" on this site - I have to say that I am dumbfounded. We are where we're at. We are not a wealthy club. You just can't replace players or managerial types willy nilly as some people suggest. Further, teams are built from sound foundations. You don't just have a wholesale clearance and start again and somehow win the league the year after you were struggling to avoid relegation. This FIFA Manager mentality is fine in some situations but certainly not in the real world. Some people should just get a grip.
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: mach1  
Date:   Sun 14 Apr 20:00

PARrot is a nice old bird, but sometimes a bit of hard reality is required to be faced up to by the players and everyone in any position at the club.

The whole setup needs a review of what we want and what targets are acceptable for next season and thereafter, footballing wise and financially.
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: KirklistonPar  
Date:   Sun 14 Apr 20:16

The way I seen the game yesterday was that If Anderson hadn’t missed the penalty the we would of gone on to easily win the game. As it turned out Anderson missed, we then went on to hit the post twice & the crossbar. Falkirk scored from their only decent chance in the game. If we’d had a bit of luck then one of Falkirks defensive clearances would of gone in instead of hitting the post. It’s a funny old game as they say & yesterday proved it.
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: Berkey  
Date:   Sun 14 Apr 20:30

Kirkliston, Scully made a great low save and they had a few shots from the edge of the box but that’s about it.

They didn’t have more quality than us, the had more fight, desire and will to win. Our team went on thier summer holidays immediatly after the final whistle went in the Alloa game.

Just sitting here drenched in my own positivity! AJ is gone!
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: 1985Par  
Date:   Sun 14 Apr 21:10

I rarely ( if ever) feel short-changed in terms of the effort the players put in. Can't think of anyone was didn't put a shift in yesterday. Players look short of confidence and many were well off their best but that happens. Falkirk didn't win because they " wanted it more than us". They won because their effort went in and our efforts were well saved or hit the woodwork. We have average championship players. Consequently we have an average championship team. Consequently we are mid table in the championship.
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: GG Riva  
Date:   Sun 14 Apr 21:23

''The whole setup needs a review of what we want and what targets are acceptable for next season and thereafter, footballing wise and financially.''

I couldn't agree with you more, mach1, but what makes you think the Chairman doesn't sit down with the manager at the end of every season, to review the one just ended and set the budget and targets for the next?

This isn't speculation, btw.



Not your average Sunday League player.
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: mach1  
Date:   Mon 15 Apr 09:22

I've no idea what they all do GG, but whatever it is it hasn't proved very successful, unless staying alive is seen as success.

Personally, I think our current structure limits our ability to increase income and hence our competitiveness and think we will be a mid table team for a long while to come.

Safe, but uninspiring.

As you know I have been a Pars fan for coming on 60 years, and will continue to be so, but this season has done very little to attract any new fans to the club, which I see as a concern.
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: wee eck  
Date:   Mon 15 Apr 10:01

How do you think our structure could be changed to increase our income, mach1? I'm sure we'd all like to hear how that could be done.
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: theparsman1885  
Date:   Mon 15 Apr 10:05

Haven’t we got the third biggest budget in the league this season...? Yet we sit only a matter of a couple of points above Alloa?

This isn’t about money, it’s about chronic underperformance all season.
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: SergioDuarte  
Date:   Mon 15 Apr 10:22

The club are conning the fans. £18 to watch dire hoof ball. No desire, no passion. Not one player is willing to get on the ball. Not one player brave enough. They just lump it forward and pass the buck. The sooner this season ends , the better.
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: renegade master  
Date:   Mon 15 Apr 10:23

Ex players I have spoken to have said the abuse at times from our own fans is the worst in Scotland and I'm afraid players from this club have player friends at other clubs and it is a major part of off the field chats between players.

Trust me it does impinge on players when being offered contracts with us and other teams on what comes with the package and a few pound here and there over certain other things do make a difference.

We used to be a club where we could win over players on the strength of our support we are now losing players on the back of the small group of supporters the yell some awful things at our own players.

Remember the wives and children of these players can also be sitting in earshot of these verbal assaults.

PS very few players use social media to check what fans are saying good or bad!

In some cases I really think we are our own worst enemies!
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: LochgellyAlbert  
Date:   Mon 15 Apr 12:01

^^^^ Totally agree, sensible post at last!
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: da_no_1  
Date:   Mon 15 Apr 12:05

That's because some of our fans think theyre entitled to do and say as they please.

"Some days will stay a 1000 years, some pass like the flash of a spark"
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: GG Riva  
Date:   Mon 15 Apr 12:07

Quote:

mach1, Mon 15 Apr 09:22

I've no idea what they all do GG, but whatever it is it hasn't proved very successful, unless staying alive is seen as success.


OK, I'll spell it out for you. At the end of the season, the chairman will sit down with the manager, to discuss next season's budget and targets and also to look at which players will be allowed to leave the club and the type of player they want to add to the squad.

This happens every season, with varying degrees of success. The last good turnover was AJ's first season. Since then, it has been disappointing, at best.



Not your average Sunday League player.
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: PARrot  
Date:   Mon 15 Apr 12:55

I'm glad to hear few players check in. It can't be good for their moral reading some of the stuff on here.

[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: mach1  
Date:   Mon 15 Apr 18:49

I was half serious GG.

I'm pretty sure I have a faint idea how club Boards operate, given that Jimmy Watters was my wife's cousin's husband.

My point was more around the limited ambition that the club can seriously have, given the financial situation and the structure of the club as a fan based organisation, with limited ability to attract new money from promoters or sugar daddies as some are affectionately known.

I'd like to see the Amazon East End Stadium for next year, with a cash boost from them in return.
Invite Jeff Bezos to perform a grand opening ceremony.
If they won't pay their taxes, a bit of community support would be no bad thing.

Seriously, I feel we need to start thinking out the box as to how we can grow our club and hence our team.
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: Rastapari  
Date:   Wed 17 Apr 06:59

Can we just take a moment to recognise the hoof ball currently being played....incoherent crappy hoof ball.....is it ok to expect an attempt at football by our new management team or are we going to sleepwalk into another year of abject garbage with them through sentiment?

I Hope You're Ok Today....
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: wee eck  
Date:   Wed 17 Apr 09:41

I don't know how many games you go to, Rastapari, but there have been many instances where we have played attractive, passing football which has created chances; the first halves at Firhill and Dingwall and the 17-pass move at Alloa which produced the winning goal spring to mind from recent games.

I don't know if it's coincidence that these were all away from home.
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: theparsman1885  
Date:   Wed 17 Apr 09:51

One swallow and all that wee eck. Rasta has a good point. The football has been absolute dross since Crawford took over. Not that AJ was all THAT much better but you have to recognise it definitely was.
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: wee eck  
Date:   Wed 17 Apr 10:17

I counted at least three swallows...

Our home record has been abysmal this season under both managers and that's the football most fans see unfortunately. That's probably worth a debate in itself.
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: Stanza  
Date:   Wed 17 Apr 12:40

I do think mach1 has a point about the Community Interest Company (CIC) ownership and structure of our club limiting our possibility of success (if "success" is to be measured by achievements on the field of play, as all fans want.)

The CIC structure was designed during and immediately after the administration crisis, and the main objective was to produce stability and a sustainable future for the football club. In that respect it has been a resounding success and is a tribute to those who wrote all the documentation and got the buy-in of people and supporter groups with the money to rescue the club. I cannot think of any better (or even any other) way this could have been achieved.

Understandably given our history, the CIC arrangement is deliberately designed to prohibit the possibility of one person/family/company having a controlling interest in the CIC (and therefore of the football club, which is 94% owned by the CIC.) And as the CIC does not pay dividends to the directors, the only motivation to be a Board member is to be a Pars fan prepared to put in long hours for no reward. Again, we have been extraordinarily fortunate in the quality of people willing to take on this role.

But this does all mean that access to really significant private money, whether by a sugar daddy or by a big private company, is going to be very difficult to obtain, particularly for a provincial club low down the league structure. I know the present Board have worked very hard to wipe out the memories of DAFC's past indiscretions, and achieving corporate sponsorship from the likes of SRJ, Purvis and others is no mean feat. I think the Chairman has said publicly that probably the only big opportunity left is the naming rights to the stadium.

So where does that leave us? As can be seen in recent seasons we can certainly compete near the top of the Championship (had it not been for Ashcroft being wrongly sent off in last season's play-off we might even have been a Premiership side this season) but we are always likely to be out-spent by clubs with outside income sources and/or parachute payments, and the likelihood of a return to the glories of the 1960s or the 2000s is fanciful.

That may not be enough to satisfy fans who lived through those periods of success, and there could come a time when this is reflected in attendances, volunteer involvement and perhaps even the willingness of Board members to endure the criticism that will come their way. A decision may then have to be made whether it is better to be an honest community club with limited success, or to go for success on the field at the expense of these values and at the risk of repeating our past financial mistakes. As always with DAFC, the future will be interesting!

_________________

Support Pars United (costs you nothing) when you shop online with 3100 retailers and insurance firms etc, including Argos, Amazon, John Lewis, Tesco, LV=, O2 etc.
http://www.easyfundraising.org.uk/causes/parsalive
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: wee eck  
Date:   Wed 17 Apr 13:31

Great post, Stanza. Reading some of the posts on the forum I sometimes think some fans would take onfield success at any price despite our recent history.
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: Rastapari  
Date:   Wed 17 Apr 13:49

Quote:

wee eck, Wed 17 Apr 09:41

I don't know how many games you go to, Rastapari, but there have been many instances where we have played attractive, passing football which has created chances; the first halves at Firhill and Dingwall and the 17-pass move at Alloa which produced the winning goal spring to mind from recent games.

I don't know if it's coincidence that these were all away from home.


There have been spells of football but you expect that at a lower level than us..what I've witnessed the rest of the time is aimless crap.
There are plenty of examples of manager's picking up someone else's squad and putting their identity on it..I just haven't seen it here yet.
As I've admitted before I don't get sentimental or dewy eyed over ex players so in my opinion the football has been garbage...meh if you like.
It would be tragic to have someone build a squad if the plan is hoofball...and yet another season over early doors.

I Hope You're Ok Today....
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: JimMcDAFC  
Date:   Wed 17 Apr 15:17

Great post stanza, I would prefer us to stay as a community owned club.Having said that this does not mean we have to put up with the sort of football we have witnessed at home this season. I am not blaming SC for this this season as he inherited AJs players mostly and very few of them seem capable of taking on and going past opposition players. Maybe us fans are a bit to blame as we seem to play a bit better away from home but to many of the players just seem to be going through the motions and believe they will just move on to another similar club and the circle goes on and they spin out a career this way, beats getting a proper job. Or am i just to cynical.
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: wee eck  
Date:   Wed 17 Apr 15:19

Yeah, I think you've mentioned that you didn't fancy Crawford as manager.
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: Rastapari  
Date:   Wed 17 Apr 15:38

Quote:

wee eck, Wed 17 Apr 15:19

Yeah, I think you've mentioned that you didn't fancy Crawford as manager.


If there had been a credible alternative to the hoofball I would take him in a second...however.
Is it wrong to want to be at least partially entertained?
The 5 wins deserve credit...the falling apart afterwards...not so much.

I Hope You're Ok Today....
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: SergioDuarte  
Date:   Wed 17 Apr 16:02

The football under SC has been absolutely dire . Totally not acceptable in this day and age. I just hope that it’s due to the utter dross in the squad rather than SC footballing philosophy. I think it would be utterly negligent not to reassess at the end of the season.
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: GG Riva  
Date:   Wed 17 Apr 16:13

Quote:

SergioDuarte, Wed 17 Apr 16:02

The football under SC has been absolutely dire . Totally not acceptable in this day and age. I just hope that it’s due to the utter dross in the squad rather than SC footballing philosophy. I think it would be utterly negligent not to reassess at the end of the season.


I don't think SC ever played "hoofball" as you so quaintly describe it, so you'll have to draw your own conclusions, Sergio, but I'm willing to bet that if we had players with the quality of an Eden Hazard or a Virgil van Djyk, we might see a more aesthetic brand of football most weeks.....



Not your average Sunday League player.
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: eastendalloapar  
Date:   Wed 17 Apr 16:21

Perhaps when we get rid of the below PAR players this summer, we might be able to get better in. A team such as ours should have a good first 11 with a couple of experienced older pros, plus decent cover players, but not necessarily 11. The reserve team should have a mixture of youth and the cover players.
For next season it will be interesting to see what the squad will be like. I just hope that it will be a Championship squad.

matt forsyth
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: Rastapari  
Date:   Wed 17 Apr 16:25

Quote:

GG Riva, Wed 17 Apr 16:13

Quote:

SergioDuarte, Wed 17 Apr 16:02

The football under SC has been absolutely dire . Totally not acceptable in this day and age. I just hope that it’s due to the utter dross in the squad rather than SC footballing philosophy. I think it would be utterly negligent not to reassess at the end of the season.


I don't think SC ever played "hoofball" as you so quaintly describe it, so you'll have to draw your own conclusions, Sergio, but I'm willing to bet that if we had players with the quality of an Eden Hazard or a Virgil van Djyk, we might see a more aesthetic brand of football most weeks.....


Football can be played with lesser components...we've seen it....we're just not seeing it now.

I Hope You're Ok Today....
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: SergioDuarte  
Date:   Wed 17 Apr 18:33

Quote:

GG Riva, Wed 17 Apr 16:13

Quote:

SergioDuarte, Wed 17 Apr 16:02

The football under SC has been absolutely dire . Totally not acceptable in this day and age. I just hope that it’s due to the utter dross in the squad rather than SC footballing philosophy. I think it would be utterly negligent not to reassess at the end of the season.


I don't think SC ever played "hoofball" as you so quaintly describe it, so you'll have to draw your own conclusions, Sergio, but I'm willing to bet that if we had players with the quality of an Eden Hazard or a Virgil van Djyk, we might see a more aesthetic brand of football most weeks.....


So the next level up from hoofball is Eden Hazard and VVD ? There’s surely some middle ground. What I witnessed on Saturday was more like Sunday League. I can’t believe that Crawford is sending his team out to play that way.
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: GG Riva  
Date:   Wed 17 Apr 19:46

Quote:

SergioDuarte, Wed 17 Apr 16:02

So the next level up from hoofball is Eden Hazard and VVD ? There’s surely some middle ground. What I witnessed on Saturday was more like Sunday League. I can’t believe that Crawford is sending his team out to play that way.


No, of course not. I was just quoting two ridiculously talented players for maximum effect. It was another way of saying that Crawford is trying to make the best of the hand he was dealt.

I don't think he wants his team to lump the ball up the park at every opportunity, but he doesn't appear to be doing anything to stop it.....



Not your average Sunday League player.
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: eastendalloapar  
Date:   Wed 17 Apr 20:19

When we had Petrie, Brittain, Smith and Robertson. Robertson always hoofed the ball up to Petrie who ran up the wing and put a ball across the face of the box where Andy or Gerry would frequently score. That was hoofball with a purpose. We ended up 5th in the Premier league. I remember we were referred to as the Scottish Wimbledon.

matt forsyth
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: mach1  
Date:   Wed 17 Apr 20:21

The manager has to be able to impose his preferred style of play and if the players can't or won't do it, it is his job to change things surely.

TBF to Crawford, the team have been lumping long balls to small forwards for years now.
They seem unable to maintain quality play for more than minutes in any game, or for more than a few games in any season. And that even goes back to when Jefferies was the manager.
Apart from our promotion season to the Championship that is.

To be fair to him again, the players at his disposal are not very good and there are no funds available to improve much.
We have no recognisable youth policy, or scouting structure that is making any difference.

We have poor choices for leaders on the field, or for an individual to become a good captain and lead by example.

We have seen players with young potential such as Williamson, Martin, Smith and others not developing as hoped.
We have seen players such as Geggan, Moffat, Aird, Morris, Clark, Wedderburn, M'voto, Spence, BRE, Falkingham, Cardle, Faissal, Paton, McCabe leave to be replaced, largely imo, by worse players.

In short, I cannot blame Crawford too much for the pretty crap football we have had to watch.
The seeds were sown, before he was appointed, the Board took the affordable option, instead of looking elsewhere for a manager with a decent track record and for me Stevie shouldnt be blamed for what is really a situation mostly outwith his control.
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: chewie  
Date:   Wed 17 Apr 20:57

Excellent post Stanza. It does no harm to remind us of the journey we are on from time to time. The community style club is the way to go for us, but there are a couple of missing links just now.

The players just don't seem to be buying into it. We had this before, even in mid table League 1. Jim Jeffries managed to instil this in the players and it passed throughout the club to the fans. Falkingham, Geggan, Cardle were all part of it. Guys like Andy Barrowman had limited ability, but they tried their hardest and not many fans have a bad word to say about them. I remember players and fans alike going wild celebrating a late winner against Stenhousemuir.

I'm not saying I want to be down there struggling again. I just want the team to dig in and play for each other and look like they care. Some of them do, but it is in a nervous, frustrated, scared to express themselves kind of way. Others simply do not. We have had mere glimpses of this in the last 2 years - Tannadice, Grangemouth, the cup games last season. But it hasn't lasted.

Average players can get promoted out of this league. When the current bunch leave, they will not drop a level. They are decent enough, it just isn't working for them here - and the fans realise it. The 2 Falkirk home games and Rovers were terrible. If we went toe to toe with them, we would have won them all. Certain of that.

I can understand why they appointed guys with a good history at the club when AJ left. The spirit was missing. SC may or may not be the one to bring the players in that can do a Livi or an Ayr to get out of this league. That's what we need to emulate, not big spending Ross County or Dundee Utd. It doesn't help his case when he continually picks some of these guys who lack the character of those players at Livi and Ayr. Tough talking ahead, I don't envy the board. It needs fixing and he deserves the chance to present his vision.
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: theparsman1885  
Date:   Wed 17 Apr 22:55

The business model of the club does not mean that we should be accepting underperformance! Regardless of the set up we must still have one of the highest(if not the 3rd highest) budget in the league. We are underperforming. Nothing to do with any negative impact of any club set up, so let’s not be waving that about as a potential flag to defend the performance right now.
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: da_no_1  
Date:   Wed 17 Apr 23:40

Some people seem to love sucking the life out of anything to do with DAFC. Strange way to live your life.

"Some days will stay a 1000 years, some pass like the flash of a spark"
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: Stanza  
Date:   Thu 18 Apr 00:03

Topic Originator: theparsman1885 like | nolike
Date: Wed 17 Apr 22:55

The business model of the club does not mean that we should be accepting underperformance! Regardless of the set up we must still have one of the highest(if not the 3rd highest) budget in the league. We are underperforming. Nothing to do with any negative impact of any club set up, so let’s not be waving that about as a potential flag to defend the performance right now.


I don't know if our "budget" is the 3rd-highest in the league, but what matters more than the total budget in terms of onfield success is usually the money available to the manager to spend on players. A good manager will spend wisely, a poor manager will spend unwisely, and the results will show this - but the general relationship between spending on wages and final league position is well-established.

My guess (and it's no more than that) is that Ross County, Dundee United, Inverness, Partick Thistle and (possibly even) Falkirk will have been able to make more money available to their managers for player wages this season than has been the case at DAFC. My earlier post was seeking only to flag up the long term effect of similar financial gaps being repeated every season.

Having said that, I think most fans will agree that we have underperformed this season, and nobody that I know is seeking to defend the performances or the final league position, whatever it is.

_________________

Support Pars United (costs you nothing) when you shop online with 3100 retailers and insurance firms etc, including Argos, Amazon, John Lewis, Tesco, LV=, O2 etc.
http://www.easyfundraising.org.uk/causes/parsalive
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: SergioDuarte  
Date:   Thu 18 Apr 08:11

Quote:

da_no_1, Wed 17 Apr 23:40

Some people seem to love sucking the life out of anything to do with DAFC. Strange way to live your life.


The only ones sucking the life out the pars are the charlatans chancers that play for the club.
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: RossDAFC  
Date:   Thu 18 Apr 11:57

Look at a team like Livi, limited ability and tipped to go straight back down. Easily one of the hardest working teams who all play for each other. The second half of their season wasn't as good as the first but they are comfortably safe in the big league. I seen a lot of people write off Ayr this year and ability wise i'd say we beat them man for man. But their work rate and persistence is superior and it has shown (having a goalscoring striker helps too!).

In terms of fan ownership, it's great for getting us stable again but we have to look to do what Dundee done and seek outside investment eventually if we want to progress. Having a football club is great but just simply existing doesn't really match the ambition of our fans.
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: wee eck  
Date:   Thu 18 Apr 12:46

I wouldn't have thought Dundee were shining example of what can be done with outside investment.
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: RossDAFC  
Date:   Thu 18 Apr 14:28

A top 6 team up until last season where a mix of the Hartley effect and poor club management has cost them. Futhermore, they don't actually own Dens so this has impacted their cash flow negatively. My mate says not having a director of football to regulate transfers has been another main pillar of their downfall. Point being they are in the top league with a similar fanbase to ours due to broadening horizons and seeking outside investment.
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: Stanza  
Date:   Thu 18 Apr 14:34

"we have to look to do what Dundee done and seek outside investment......"

You really must be joking!

Dundee have been in administration twice since 2003 and have had a succession of outside investors with "questionable" backgrounds and/or interest in Dundee FC. The result has been debts of up to £20m at one point, wholesale sackings of staff and players on two occasions, and the loss of ownership of Dens Park (they may have it back now, I'm not sure.)

_________________

Support Pars United (costs you nothing) when you shop online with 3100 retailers and insurance firms etc, including Argos, Amazon, John Lewis, Tesco, LV=, O2 etc.
http://www.easyfundraising.org.uk/causes/parsalive
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: RossDAFC  
Date:   Thu 18 Apr 14:43

Yes i understand there has been mismanagement of Dundee, it's the idea that I was suggesting not necessarily the execution...
[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: PARrot  
Date:   Thu 18 Apr 16:05

Quote:

RossDAFC, Thu 18 Apr 14:43

Yes i understand there has been mismanagement of Dundee, it's the idea that I was suggesting not necessarily the execution...


Any more ideas like that and execution will be just punishment.

[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Re: The Way We Talk.
Topic Originator: Playup_Pompey  
Date:   Fri 19 Apr 10:50

aye get rid of the "cr@p" players. Same posters said the same last summer about nickly clark and look where that got us

[IP address logged]
Report Abuse   Reply To This Message
 Top of Board  |  Forum List  |  Threaded View   Forum Rules  |  Newer Topic  |  Older Topic  |  end 


f=[], target=[], forgotpass=[] ,
 Forum List  |  Need a Login? Register Here 
 User Login
 User Name:
 Password:
 Remember my login:
   
 Forgot Your Password?
Enter your email address or user name below and a new password will be sent to the email address associated with your profile.
Security : type 'pars' in the box:
email: