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Topic Originator: OzPar
Date: Thu 14 Nov 22:31
Hearts player Kenneth Vargas has said he wants to leave Hearts.
“Scotland is a great place, but football-wise they don`t have such a good level, everyone knows that. I want to play against better-level players.”
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Topic Originator: Rigger Al
Date: Thu 14 Nov 22:41
Quote:
OzPar, Thu 14 Nov 22:31
Hearts player Kenneth Vargas has said he wants to leave Hearts.
“Scotland is a great place, but football-wise they don`t have such a good level, everyone knows that. I want to play against better-level players.”
cant disagree with him Oz
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Topic Originator: RossF
Date: Thu 14 Nov 23:06
He perhaps has a point but it would sound more plausible coming from a player who is tearing teams apart week in/week out. Vargas is definitely not doing that.
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Topic Originator: NMCmassive
Date: Thu 14 Nov 23:41
He’s definitely got a point but for a nation our size with the finances available we’re probably roughly where we should be 🤷🏻♂️
He should be more worried about being in the long list of second rate foreigners that came here cos they never made it at home and let’s be honest, he’d only really be an average player here that gets brought up in an Edinburgh pub every so often.
COYP
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Topic Originator: Bovril Man
Date: Fri 15 Nov 02:54
He has ideas above his station. Apart from being quick, he hasn’t shown any reason why a bigger team in a better league should be interested in him. I suspect his manager has told him this and he’s taken the huff…
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Topic Originator: GG Riva
Date: Fri 15 Nov 07:13
That`s an interesting one. I wouldn`t know Vargas from Adam and have even less idea about his footballing ability, but I`d hesitate to criticise any player who wants to test himself at a higher level. It happens in all walks of life. People put in for promotion. If they get it, they may do well or fail to cope, but they won`t know until they`ve tried it. Vargas is ambitious. there`s nothing wrong with that. Playing with better players is likely to improve his own game, I believe.
The real uncomfortable truth that the OP alludes to is that Scorttish football has been overtaken by many other countries in our lifetime. Oz and I (and a good few other lucky posters on here) grew up watching the Pars playing European football in the 60s. They were more than a match for many clubs, which still feature regularly in European competitions. Other Scottish clubs, including the OF, Aberdeen and Dundee United, continued to do well in Europe until the mid 80s. Since then, I think Celtic and then Rangers, have managed to reach one and two European finals, respectively, but fallen at that hurdle each time. Every other club has normally been eliminated by teams that would once have been regarded as minnows.
Not your average Sunday League player.
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Topic Originator: Parfect69
Date: Fri 15 Nov 08:11
Aye cause he scooshing it at this level right enough. What a tool
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Topic Originator: Buspasspar
Date: Fri 15 Nov 08:24
Good Post GG
We are forever shaped by the Children we once were
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Topic Originator: wee eck
Date: Fri 15 Nov 09:52
I see Steve Clarke was comparing the way Scotland and Croatia, with a smaller population of around 4m, develop young players. He says there is much more emphasis there on giving promising young players the opportunity to play at first-team level before they go off to progress elsewhere. Our best young players like Gilmour and Doak preferred to move on because of a lack of opportunities at home. There are still loads of journeymen pros in Scotland from all over the world keeping young Scots out of first-team squads.
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Topic Originator: veteraneastender
Date: Fri 15 Nov 10:06
Vargas`s personal opinion mindset of himself apart, the number of foreign players currently in the SPL indicates how very average our home grown talent is, with a few exceptions.
GG and I can mind when they were few and far between - and those that did come here then although decent enough players were nothing more.
The appearance of top raters like Larsson and Laudrup drove home the message of how far behind the Scottish domestic game had become.
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Topic Originator: Bandy
Date: Fri 15 Nov 10:21
He’s definitely got a point but for a nation our size with the finances available we’re probably roughly where we should be
Completely disagree - Scottish Football is absolutely miles behind where it could be (I won`t use should as that reeks of entitlement).
So many countries of similar populations (and smaller) are ahead of us:
I think all of these countries have populations of around 10m or less, and have outperformed Scotland in the last 30 years.
Portugal
Switzerland
Austria
Croatia
Denmark
Norway
Uruguay
Iceland (< 400,000)
Greece
Serbia
Even Belgium have a population of only 11m, and they`ve been ranked as high as number 2 in the world (and should have won the 2016 Euros).
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Topic Originator: d3monstrate
Date: Fri 15 Nov 13:22
Wales also did well with their recent golden generation...
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Topic Originator: Bandy
Date: Fri 15 Nov 14:08
Excellent point. A relatively recent Euros semi and the group stages of the world cup. In a country that cares a lot more about rugby.
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Topic Originator: DunPar
Date: Fri 15 Nov 14:50
Imagine if Scottish football fans actually had the patience to learn from football people from footballing countries that are far more successful than we are e.g. imagine we did as they did and built academies to provide better facilities to develop young talent and build our squads for the long term instead of blowing what little money our clubs might have on has-been journeymen.
wait a minute ……..
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Topic Originator: jake89
Date: Fri 15 Nov 14:56
Quote:
DunPar, Fri 15 Nov 14:50
Imagine if Scottish football fans actually had the patience to learn from football people from footballing countries that are far more successful than we are e.g. imagine we did as they did and built academies to provide better facilities to develop young talent and build our squads for the long term instead of blowing what little money our clubs might have on has-been journeymen.
wait a minute ……..
Academies could help the national team but for clubs like Dunfermline it`s risky. I`m a great believer in our academy but it`s not going to make us a fortune overnight. They can be expensive to run and you may not get a return on that investment for many years. That`s why so many clubs just buy the finished product instead. You`d think most clubs would realise that isn`t sustainable. Unfortunately, Scottish football is negatively impacted by the massive TV deal a few miles down the road. Why play in the Scottish Premier for Hibs when you could get more money playing in the English second division where you`d have more exposure?
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Topic Originator: Buster_Brown
Date: Fri 15 Nov 15:05
Quote:
DunPar, Fri 15 Nov 14:50
Imagine if Scottish football fans actually had the patience to learn from football people from footballing countries that are far more successful than we are e.g. imagine we did as they did and built academies to provide better facilities to develop young talent and build our squads for the long term instead of blowing what little money our clubs might have on has-been journeymen.
wait a minute ……..
Having been involved at the Forth Valley Academy for 10 years and in my current SPFL Academy for the last 7, I’ve seen all kind of SFA think tanks, ideas, solutions come in from all across Europe….. it’s only my belief, but I think the ethos now, is probably the best it’s been….and again in the 17 years, I’ve seen hundreds and hundreds of lads come through the various age groups, of which….maybe 7 or 8 have gone on to establish themself at a Scottish Full Time First Team, only 1 has gone on to have a successful International career….and even that was through his adopted country.
That’s how slow the process of youth development is here, that’s down to a huge amount of factors….but the biggest is probably opportunity. Clubs don’t give the lads opportunities, all too often we turn to non-Scottish markets and bring players in, a good number of times, these players are no better than what’s currently on offer.
With no money, and little opportunity for youth, how does the domestic game improve??
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Topic Originator: da_no_1
Date: Fri 15 Nov 16:02
Quote:
Bandy, Fri 15 Nov 14:08
Excellent point. A relatively recent Euros semi and the group stages of the world cup. In a country that cares a lot more about rugby.
Obviously helped by having one of the best players in the world playing for them. Since he`s retired they`ve fell off a cliff.
"Some days will stay a 1000 years, some pass like the flash of a spark"
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Topic Originator: parathletic
Date: Fri 15 Nov 16:19
Wales have lost one of their last 14 matches.
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Topic Originator: da_no_1
Date: Fri 15 Nov 16:43
Quote:
parathletic, Fri 15 Nov 16:19
Wales have lost one of their last 14 matches.
Wins against Montenegro, Gibraltar, Latvia, scudded off Slovakia. Drew with Gibraltar also.
Compared to where they were (8th in FIFA rankings 2015), they`ve plummeted.
"Some days will stay a 1000 years, some pass like the flash of a spark"
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Topic Originator: NMCmassive
Date: Fri 15 Nov 16:46
Quote:
DunPar, Fri 15 Nov 14:50
Imagine if Scottish football fans actually had the patience to learn from football people from footballing countries that are far more successful than we are e.g. imagine we did as they did and built academies to provide better facilities to develop young talent and build our squads for the long term instead of blowing what little money our clubs might have on has-been journeymen.
wait a minute ……..
It’s not the fans tho 🤷🏻♂️ surely the Scottish professionals should shoulder their responsibility
COYP
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Topic Originator: Steviethepar2
Date: Fri 15 Nov 17:05
Quote:
da_no_1, Fri 15 Nov 16:43
Quote:
parathletic, Fri 15 Nov 16:19
Wales have lost one of their last 14 matches.
Wins against Montenegro, Gibraltar, Latvia, scudded off Slovakia. Drew with Gibraltar also.
Compared to where they were (8th in FIFA rankings 2015), they`ve plummeted.
What I laugh at is old coefficient old form and hearts can do something in Europe this season few decent results bangs it up but Scotland are just holding us back - Clark is abysmal as a manager and performances / results since we qualified for the euros (and in the euros) have been shocking given even lower ranked countries did better than us
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Topic Originator: parathletic
Date: Fri 15 Nov 17:05
Topic Originator: da_no_1 like
Date: Fri 15 Nov 16:43
Quote:
parathletic, Fri 15 Nov 16:19
Wales have lost one of their last 14 matches.
Wins against Montenegro, Gibraltar, Latvia, scudded off Slovakia. Drew with Gibraltar also.
Compared to where they were (8th in FIFA rankings 2015), they`ve plummeted.
"Some days will stay a 1000 years, some pass like the flash of a spark"
They took 4 points from 6 against Croatia too.They obviously aren`t the same team without Bale but a ranking of 29th to our 51st isn`t bad.
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Topic Originator: da_no_1
Date: Fri 15 Nov 18:08
Quote:
parathletic, Fri 15 Nov 17:05
Topic Originator: da_no_1 like
Date: Fri 15 Nov 16:43
Quote:
parathletic, Fri 15 Nov 16:19
Wales have lost one of their last 14 matches.
Wins against Montenegro, Gibraltar, Latvia, scudded off Slovakia. Drew with Gibraltar also.
Compared to where they were (8th in FIFA rankings 2015), they`ve plummeted.
"Some days will stay a 1000 years, some pass like the flash of a spark"
They took 4 points from 6 against Croatia too.They obviously aren`t the same team without Bale but a ranking of 29th to our 51st isn`t bad.
I wasn`t comparing them to us. They won`t qualify for any tournaments anytime soon. Bale dragged them to tournaments in the past.
"Some days will stay a 1000 years, some pass like the flash of a spark"
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Topic Originator: Dave_1885
Date: Fri 15 Nov 18:14
Wales win in Turkyie tomorrow and they are in pole position for promotion back to League A of Nations League………
Our reluctance to give young lads a chance at international level and stick with the old pals act over the years certainly hasn’t helped us. Too much nonsense of “wanting to protect the young lad” instead of giving them a chance.
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Topic Originator: DA-go Par Adonis
Date: Fri 15 Nov 20:10
Like Ben Doak with 8 starts in club football, currently winning his 5th cap?
Or Gilmour, who had started only a handful of games for Chelsea before his Scotland debut.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I love it when we go sell Kevin Nisbet,
He's gonna pay for everyone this season.
Post Edited (Fri 15 Nov 20:27)
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Topic Originator: TAFKA_Super_Petrie
Date: Fri 15 Nov 20:11
Wales have looked really good in the couple of games i`ve seen them under Bellmany, really seems to have put his stamp on the team; very direct and a lot of pace.
---------------------------------------------------------------
"People always talk about Ronaldinho and magic, but I didn't see him today. I saw Henrik Larsson; that's where the magic was."
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Topic Originator: da_no_1
Date: Fri 15 Nov 20:47
Quote:
Dave_1885, Fri 15 Nov 18:14
Wales win in Turkyie tomorrow and they are in pole position for promotion back to League A of Nations League………
Our reluctance to give young lads a chance at international level and stick with the old pals act over the years certainly hasn’t helped us. Too much nonsense of “wanting to protect the young lad” instead of giving them a chance.
I`ll stick my neck out. They won`t beat Turkey.
"Some days will stay a 1000 years, some pass like the flash of a spark"
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Topic Originator: d3monstrate
Date: Fri 15 Nov 20:50
I saw a good stat on Facebook, dont know how true it is, but said that of all the minutes played in the Scottish Premiership, most teams had less than 5% given to Scottish under 21s. 4 or 5 had 0% (both OF included). Most was Motherwell by quote some distance at 18%...
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Topic Originator: Dave_1885
Date: Fri 15 Nov 21:47
Quote:
da_no_1, Fri 15 Nov 20:47
Quote:
Dave_1885, Fri 15 Nov 18:14
Wales win in Turkyie tomorrow and they are in pole position for promotion back to League A of Nations League………
Our reluctance to give young lads a chance at international level and stick with the old pals act over the years certainly hasn’t helped us. Too much nonsense of “wanting to protect the young lad” instead of giving them a chance.
I`ll stick my neck out. They won`t beat Turkey.
The chances are low but you never know. Good result for us tonight and Doak was a ray of light - glad Clarke has finally seen sense in playing him. Conway falling foul of all of our strikers of late of not having anything really created for them though.
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Topic Originator: Dave_1885
Date: Fri 15 Nov 21:47
Quote:
d3monstrate, Fri 15 Nov 20:50
I saw a good stat on Facebook, dont know how true it is, but said that of all the minutes played in the Scottish Premiership, most teams had less than 5% given to Scottish under 21s. 4 or 5 had 0% (both OF included). Most was Motherwell by quote some distance at 18%...
If you removed Lennon Miller and David Watson then its extremely grim reading
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