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Topic Originator: jake89
Date: Sun 29 Sep 12:11
How much ownership is actually for sale? My understanding is the German shares are actually quite small like 20-25% but they can cash in a loan agreement meaning it`s actually 75%? So are they selling a 25% share with money owed, or a 75% share?
I suppose the real question I`m asking is - how much to buy them out? What figures are being put out there? I`d rather local investment but is there opportunity to look overseas? You`ll never make much if any money from a football club in Scotland but what about people overseas with links to Dunfermline? Maybe want to throw a few quid?
Post Edited (Sun 29 Sep 12:13)
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Topic Originator: veteraneastender
Date: Sun 29 Sep 13:16
A few quid ?
If that were the case there would be interest - but a middle ranking Scottish club like DAFC is a never ending black hole.
Post Edited (Sun 29 Sep 13:16)
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Topic Originator: Bandy
Date: Sun 29 Sep 13:26
This is it. This isn`t an investment. It`s a donation.
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Topic Originator: SeasonedPar
Date: Sun 29 Sep 14:02
David Murray once said if you want to make £1M running a Scottish football club, start with 2.
What would be more attractive financially to any buyer might be taking that majority share. Whether that’s by the Germans taking up their option or whether a buyer might try to secure for a lower price would all be part of the negotiations.
Hard to put a figure on all of that, but add in a sum for working capital and I’d guess- and it’s a guess based on what they’ve invested - deep long term pockets would be a minimum. Depends if our current investors are prepared to walk away with a loss.
For the good of the club, this needs resolved sooner rather than later, but that’ll be 2 previous owners who found out they needed deeper pockets than they’d thought.
Not just new owners, but a revamp of the leagues, eg moving to 16 clubs is badly needed and long overdue. Based on attendances, and assuming the Pars would have bigger attendances in a revamped Premier league, increased by larger travelling supports, we’d be around 7-10th best supported club in Scotland. Even so, the additional revenue from other sources is crucial.
At least the Club has potential to maximise other revenues due to the efforts of the current board to put staff in place for it. Might be a key point for the new owners.
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Topic Originator: saltonsgonagetu
Date: Sun 29 Sep 14:08
We have the biggest support in the league
, where and what is using up the money is the first question .
Maybe no matter how big a support you have in the championship it is not viable to stay in or win this league .
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Topic Originator: SeasonedPar
Date: Sun 29 Sep 14:19
Attendance revenue is only one part of any club’s income.
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Topic Originator: pars4life1
Date: Sun 29 Sep 14:48
3.5 million when they`ve put in far less than that? These ***** have take us for a ride.
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Topic Originator: weemike
Date: Sun 29 Sep 14:56
Quote:
pars4life1, Sun 29 Sept 14:48
3.5 million when they`ve put in far less than that? These ***** have take us for a ride.
I suspect that is the total Gmbh dafc are down and In a perfect world would retrieve for the club.
A lot of that money would be for unforseen costs, pitch, floodlights, etc, and a decent chunk will be excess playing staff costs, league 1, for example.
They`ll probably be looking to accept somewhere in the region of 2m for their stake. But the issues will be when someone does due diligence and realises it`s a black hole.
There is a very good chance they`ll be stuck with the club come seasons end.
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Topic Originator: cammypar 1995
Date: Sun 29 Sep 14:58
We keep getting told eep is a big upkeep what makes it different to other similar sized grounds in terms of how much it costs to maintain?
c'mon the pars
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Topic Originator: weemike
Date: Sun 29 Sep 15:05
There is also a chance that maybe there is a split between the 4 of them. I.e. 1 may have more money than the rest, etc.
We don`t know if they were all equal partners financially or if meggle, for example, was bringing expertise en lieu of capital. 1 may be sick of writing cheques or may have other financial obligations, and paying £250k to a club that will need more funding is unsustainable.
We might find in 6 months` time that the 4 way partnership changes, etc.
I personally don`t think it`s going to be as simple as person x buys them out, and they are gone altogether.
Could be a part buyout with gmbh having a lower stake and only 3 or 2 members.
The waters are muddy that`s for sure.
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Topic Originator: weemike
Date: Sun 29 Sep 15:10
Quote:
cammypar 1995, Sun 29 Sept 14:58
We keep getting told eep is a big upkeep what makes it different to other similar sized grounds in terms of how much it costs to maintain?
We have the largest of the smaller grounds. And maybe one of the oldest in terms of the newer grounds. We were maybe unlucky in the sense that the floodlights needed renovating and the pitch/undersoil heating needing fixed in such a small space of time.
All grounds are different. And the repair costs will appear at different times.
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Topic Originator: jake89
Date: Sun 29 Sep 16:05
There is no danger they`d get £3.5m. That would be like spending a load of money in the casino then expecting it back after it`s gone. At the end of the day the shares have a value and that value changes. I`d imagine it`s very low currently.
I think the main issue is anyone coming in needs more than the investment. To become self sufficient there needs to be a spend first. I`d also suggest we could do away with some of the high paid roles. That`s not a criticism necessarily but a reflection that we`re a relatively small club.
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Topic Originator: GG Riva
Date: Sun 29 Sep 16:27
Quote:
weemike, Sun 29 Sept 15:05
There is also a chance that maybe there is a split between the 4 of them. I.e. 1 may have more money than the rest, etc.
We don`t know if they were all equal partners financially or if meggle, for example, was bringing expertise en lieu of capital. 1 may be sick of writing cheques or may have other financial obligations, and paying £250k to a club that will need more funding is unsustainable.
We might find in 6 months` time that the 4 way partnership changes, etc.
I personally don`t think it`s going to be as simple as person x buys them out, and they are gone altogether.
Could be a part buyout with gmbh having a lower stake and only 3 or 2 members.
The waters are muddy that`s for sure.
I thought there were 4 investors, too, Mike, but there are actually 12 - 11 millionaires and a billionaire. No idea how much each of them contributed, but you`d think they all put in equal shares, no?
Not your average Sunday League player.
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Topic Originator: weemike
Date: Sun 29 Sep 16:35
I thought there were 4 investors, too, Mike, but there are actually 12 - 11 millionaires and a billionaire. No idea how much each of them contributed, but you`d think they all put in equal shares, no?
This is news to me. Last time I looked into the gmbhdafcfussball setup, there was just the original 4.
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Topic Originator: RossF
Date: Sun 29 Sep 16:44
Has there been much interest in the sale of the club? Wonder when we will finally have new owners in place..
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Topic Originator: Indiapar
Date: Sun 29 Sep 18:17
This can`t be helping those who work at the club. It must be unsettling. The directors have obviously made their decision,for their own reasons so hopefully this can be concluded soon. I do believe the ethos should not change in terms of youth development. What we do as a club today will determine our future tomorrow.
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Topic Originator: DunfyDave
Date: Sun 29 Sep 18:31
Quote:
cammypar 1995, Sun 29 Sep 14:58
We keep getting told eep is a big upkeep what makes it different to other similar sized grounds in terms of how much it costs to maintain?
^^^^ Broken chairs for a start
DunfyDave
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Topic Originator: Angus_W
Date: Sun 29 Sep 19:44
EEP…..
I love the place but financially it’s a money pit.
Capacity just over 11K. We’ve sold it out twice in the last 20 years it’s far too big. We would be better off with a 6-7K ground near Rosyth with Rail & M90 easily accessible.
Look at the Falkirk stadium.
- They hold concerts at the stadium no noise issues.
- Hire out the car-park for funfairs & local market.
- Good corporate business facility’s - They hire out part of their stand as office space.
That’s clever marketing they are not chasing the support for more money all the time, broadening their financial opportunity’s.
Going forward whoever takes over needs to look at the bigger picture if we are ever going to become self sufficient.
“.........it ain’t over till the Pars score!”
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Topic Originator: Indiapar
Date: Sun 29 Sep 19:49
Quote:
Angus_W, Sun 29 Sept 19:44
EEP…..
I love the place but financially it’s a money pit.
Capacity just over 11K. We’ve sold it out twice in the last 20 years it’s far too big. We would be better off with a 6-7K ground near Rosyth with Rail & M90 easily accessible.
Look at the Falkirk stadium.
- They hold concerts at the stadium no noise issues.
- Hire out the car-park for funfairs & local market.
- Good corporate business facility’s - They hire out part of their stand as office space.
That’s clever marketing they are not chasing the support for more money all the time, broadening their financial opportunity’s.
Going forward whoever takes over needs to look at the bigger picture if we are ever going to become self sufficient.
I agree. We will need to generate other sources of income. A multi use stadium with sports and other facilities would be a good investment. I suppose the issue is, who would fund it.
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Topic Originator: Buster_Brown
Date: Sun 29 Sep 20:11
You do know that the Falkirk Stadium is council owned and council run eh?? Falkirk FC make no money from the concerts, fun fair etc etc.
The original point stands and that a multi-purpose arena would benefit the club, but there`s no reason why EEP in it`s current state couldn`t do that.
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Topic Originator: Higgys Mohawk
Date: Sun 29 Sep 20:21
The main concern for me is that the club were put up for sale and then all has gone quiet. No talk of interested parties.
Could potentially be in limbo for years with a board that won’t invest anything as they want out.
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Topic Originator: Buster_Brown
Date: Sun 29 Sep 20:29
That`s very common when it come to business negotiations though. WBA are my English club and were up for sale and bought out last season and it was the same silence.
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Topic Originator: Raymie the Legend
Date: Sun 29 Sep 20:55
Quote:
JamesAndrew74, Sun 29 Sep 14:18
Quote:
jake89, Sun 29 Sep 12:11
How much ownership is actually for sale? My understanding is the German shares are actually quite small like 20-25% but they can cash in a loan agreement meaning it`s actually 75%? So are they selling a 25% share with money owed, or a 75% share?
I suppose the real question I`m asking is - how much to buy them out? What figures are being put out there? I`d rather local investment but is there opportunity to look overseas? You`ll never make much if any money from a football club in Scotland but what about people overseas with links to Dunfermline? Maybe want to throw a few quid?
3.5 million was a price quoted from a reliable source
A little over half of that and you are in the ball park to buy them out.
You’ll then need operating capital on top of that, perhaps a million
It`s bloody tough being a legend
Ron Atkinson - 1983
Post Edited (Sun 29 Sep 20:57)
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Topic Originator: SeasonedPar
Date: Sun 29 Sep 21:30
The bigger issue is the league set up. We need a bigger league, 16 clubs, to let teams like ourselves, Falkirk, Rovers, etc have a better share of revenue. The running costs in a 12 club league are destroying Scottish football.
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Topic Originator: saltonsgonagetu
Date: Sun 29 Sep 23:42
Still want an answer to why our ground is significantly more to run than Partick and Rovers who have similar size stadium ?
Apart from rubbish merchandise, legends never been upgraded in 20-30 years , Charlie Ds a joke of a hospitality space.
Stop throwing money down the youth loss making effort and get these places making money
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Topic Originator: cammypar 1995
Date: Mon 30 Sep 06:37
St Mirren is a prime example. Great wee set up they have and clearly works for them.
c'mon the pars
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Topic Originator: SeasonedPar
Date: Mon 30 Sep 08:30
Quote:
saltonsgonagetu, Sun 29 Sep 23:42
Still want an answer to why our ground is significantly more to run than Partick and Rovers who have similar size stadium ?
Apart from rubbish merchandise, legends never been upgraded in 20-30 years , Charlie Ds a joke of a hospitality space.
Stop throwing money down the youth loss making effort and get these places making money
There’s at least 6 fairly major pieces of expense over the last 3 yrs.
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Topic Originator: veteraneastender
Date: Mon 30 Sep 09:24
Quote:
SeasonedPar, Sun 29 Sep 21:30
The bigger issue is the league set up. We need a bigger league, 16 clubs, to let teams like ourselves, Falkirk, Rovers, etc have a better share of revenue. The running costs in a 12 club league are destroying Scottish football.
A reasonable suggestion in principle - but who would you expect to add to the existing 12 to enhance the Championship ?
None of the clubs in League 1 seem to have significant travelling support, so adding more fixtures is a doubtful way forward.
We, like others outside the top tier miss the visits of Celtic, Rangers, Hearts, Hibs and Aberdeen and other teams to a lesser extent - the only solution to that is promotion - and that’s not a real prospect unless there is a big change of fortunes.
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Topic Originator: Dave_1885
Date: Mon 30 Sep 09:37
Quote:
saltonsgonagetu, Sun 29 Sep 23:42
Still want an answer to why our ground is significantly more to run than Partick and Rovers who have similar size stadium ?
Apart from rubbish merchandise, legends never been upgraded in 20-30 years , Charlie Ds a joke of a hospitality space.
Stop throwing money down the youth loss making effort and get these places making money
Youve picked two awful grounds to compare it with 😂 Firhill has 3 stands, one of which (behind the goal) is nowhere near the same size as the Norrie and the Main stand is a lot older and less modern than our. Starks may have 2 similar sized end stands, but again half a main stand and a railway stand thats brick and mortar with very little outlay isn’t comparable to the North Stand.
We also use all 4 stands on match days, unlike the other clubs in the league with stadiums like ours.
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Topic Originator: pars4life1
Date: Mon 30 Sep 09:56
Hang on, I thought it was cos east end is old that it costs us money, but it turns out the really old main stands at starks or firhill are cheap to maintain?
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Topic Originator: Malcolm Canmore
Date: Mon 30 Sep 10:54
Quote:
saltonsgonagetu, Sun 29 Sep 23:42
Still want an answer to why our ground is significantly more to run than Partick and Rovers who have similar size stadium ?
Apart from rubbish merchandise, legends never been upgraded in 20-30 years , Charlie Ds a joke of a hospitality space.
Stop throwing money down the youth loss making effort and get these places making money.
Much of our internal space (Shop, Office, Boardroom, Jock Stein Lounge, Players` and Officials` areas) is all below street level. That must create issues and costs with getting light in, air conditioning, occasional water seeping in etc.
Our kitchen is excellent quality, as are our boxes, but these need to be kept in very good condition - at a cost.
Maybe Fife Council its more stringent when it comes to H&S standards and stadium licence?
My dog eats meat
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Topic Originator: SeasonedPar
Date: Mon 30 Sep 11:30
Quote:
veteraneastender, Mon 30 Sep 09:24
Quote:
SeasonedPar, Sun 29 Sep 21:30
The bigger issue is the league set up. We need a bigger league, 16 clubs, to let teams like ourselves, Falkirk, Rovers, etc have a better share of revenue. The running costs in a 12 club league are destroying Scottish football.
A reasonable suggestion in principle - but who would you expect to add to the existing 12 to enhance the Championship ?
None of the clubs in League 1 seem to have significant travelling support, so adding more fixtures is a doubtful way forward.
We, like others outside the top tier miss the visits of Celtic, Rangers, Hearts, Hibs and Aberdeen and other teams to a lesser extent - the only solution to that is promotion - and that’s not a real prospect unless there is a big change of fortunes.
I was, despite our current woes, looking up the way, VEE. A change to a 16 Premiership would mean 4 Championship teams going up. 5 if the bottom placed Premier club got relegated (unlikely).
Imagine that league that season. Plus the prospect of much greater future revenue in all ways? Sadly, the Premier clubs want their 4 home games against the OF. What a sad way to run a league.
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Topic Originator: Stanza
Date: Mon 30 Sep 12:05
In years past, Ross McArthur would provide the Supporters` Council meetings with details of significant costs and issues that the club was facing.
No doubt he held back some information that was commercially sensitive, but it certainly seemed to be a genuine attempt to educate the fanbase in how difficult it is to run a medium-sized football club in the Championship without significant outside investment, particularly when maintaining in good order a stadium larger than is needed.
Two of the clubs held up as examples in this thread (Raith and Partick) have benefited from large inward investment but still have fairly ramshackle stadia. Ayr United`s new owner has invested £3m in the club, partly to finance badly-needed stadium improvements. St Mirren and Queens Park sold Love St and Hampden for several millions. Hamilton sold Douglas Park to Sainsburys, were homeless for years and still only have half a stadium. Livi have their parachute payment. Airdrieonians own the Excelsior, and get income from renting it out to Celtic B, Celtic Women and Glasgow Uni. Falkirk don`t even own their stadium. I won't even mention Cappielow!
On the costs side of running DAFC, these are clearly much greater when done by professionals rather than by volunteers. The football backroom staff looks to be larger than before, the medical bills last year would have been enormous. There are probably budget implications of the academy and the new training ground. Compensation to sacked managers, problems with floodlights and USH, I`m sure the list is almost endless.
So perhaps some of what Ross used to do by way of communication would be useful again in explaining where the money goes in running DAFC, and why decisions are made which sometimes might be baffling for fans who don`t see the full picture.
_________________
 Support Dunfermline Athletic Disabled Supporters` Club (DADSC) when you shop online with one of 8000 firms: https://www.easyfundraising.org.uk/causes/dadsc[
Post Edited (Mon 30 Sep 12:07)
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Topic Originator: veteraneastender
Date: Mon 30 Sep 12:13
SeasonedPar,
No guarantee that we would qualify for the top tier though.
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Topic Originator: cammypar 1995
Date: Mon 30 Sep 13:15
Credit where credit is due the commercial manager was in legends selling 50/50 tickets. I`m sure we can get someone to do it for less than £100k per annum though?
c'mon the pars
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Topic Originator: wee eck
Date: Mon 30 Sep 13:17
Have you seen his payslip?
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Topic Originator: da_no_1
Date: Mon 30 Sep 13:39
Quote:
wee eck, Mon 30 Sept 13:17
Have you seen his payslip?
Of course he hasn`t! But he kens a boy in Raffles who has
"Some days will stay a 1000 years, some pass like the flash of a spark"
Post Edited (Mon 30 Sep 13:40)
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Topic Originator: Stanza
Date: Mon 30 Sep 14:07
Quote:
cammypar 1995, Mon 30 Sept 13:15
Credit where credit is due the commercial manager was in legends selling 50/50 tickets. I`m sure we can get someone to do it for less than £100k per annum though?
Presumably over and above his normal duties and workload, so effectively an unpaid volunteer. Perhaps the club would welcome another volunteer if you are interested?
_________________
Support Dunfermline Athletic Disabled Supporters` Club (DADSC) when you shop online with one of 8000 firms: https://www.easyfundraising.org.uk/causes/dadsc[
Post Edited (Mon 30 Sep 14:09)
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Topic Originator: cammypar 1995
Date: Mon 30 Sep 15:04
Quote:
da_no_1, Mon 30 Sept 13:39
Quote:
wee eck, Mon 30 Sept 13:17
Have you seen his payslip?
Of course he hasn`t! But he kens a boy in Raffles who has
Wouldn`t see me in there. At least you`re consistent with offering absolutely nothing worthwhile to any conversation I`ve got to give you that.
c'mon the pars
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Topic Originator: Rusty Shackleford
Date: Mon 30 Sep 15:16
You think a commercial manager for a second tier Scottish football club is on six figures basic?
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Topic Originator: SeasonedPar
Date: Mon 30 Sep 15:18
Quote:
veteraneastender, Mon 30 Sep 12:13
SeasonedPar,
No guarantee that we would qualify for the top tier though.
That has to be the ambition. For football and money reasons.
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Topic Originator: SeasonedPar
Date: Mon 30 Sep 15:20
Quote:
Stanza, Mon 30 Sep 12:05
In years past, Ross McArthur would provide the Supporters` Council meetings with details of significant costs and issues that the club was facing.
No doubt he held back some information that was commercially sensitive, but it certainly seemed to be a genuine attempt to educate the fanbase in how difficult it is to run a medium-sized football club in the Championship without significant outside investment, particularly when maintaining in good order a stadium larger than is needed.
Two of the clubs held up as examples in this thread (Raith and Partick) have benefited from large inward investment but still have fairly ramshackle stadia. Ayr United`s new owner has invested £3m in the club, partly to finance badly-needed stadium improvements. St Mirren and Queens Park sold Love St and Hampden for several millions. Hamilton sold Douglas Park to Sainsburys, were homeless for years and still only have half a stadium. Livi have their parachute payment. Airdrieonians own the Excelsior, and get income from renting it out to Celtic B, Celtic Women and Glasgow Uni. Falkirk don`t even own their stadium. I won`t even mention Cappielow!
On the costs side of running DAFC, these are clearly much greater when done by professionals rather than by volunteers. The football backroom staff looks to be larger than before, the medical bills last year would have been enormous. There are probably budget implications of the academy and the new training ground. Compensation to sacked managers, problems with floodlights and USH, I`m sure the list is almost endless.
So perhaps some of what Ross used to do by way of communication would be useful again in explaining where the money goes in running DAFC, and why decisions are made which sometimes might be baffling for fans who don`t see the full picture.
Excellent analysis and suggestion, Stanza
Post Edited (Mon 30 Sep 15:21)
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Topic Originator: Raymie the Legend
Date: Mon 30 Sep 15:58
I did hear that hospitality wasn`t a sell out and we had no match ball sponsor. Not sure how much truth there is in that?
It`s bloody tough being a legend
Ron Atkinson - 1983
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Topic Originator: da_no_1
Date: Mon 30 Sep 16:10
Quote:
cammypar 1995, Mon 30 Sept 15:04
Quote:
da_no_1, Mon 30 Sept 13:39
Quote:
wee eck, Mon 30 Sept 13:17
Have you seen his payslip?
Of course he hasn`t! But he kens a boy in Raffles who has
Wouldn`t see me in there. At least you`re consistent with offering absolutely nothing worthwhile to any conversation I`ve got to give you that.
No point whatsoever conversing with folk like you.
"Some days will stay a 1000 years, some pass like the flash of a spark"
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Topic Originator: Stanza
Date: Mon 30 Sep 16:21
Quote:
JamesAndrew74, Mon 30 Sept 14:35
That’s absolutely part of his workload.
I`m struggling to believe that standing selling 50/50 tickets is part of the Commercial Manager`s contractual duties.
If you (and the person suggesting he earns £100k pa) have access to his personal contract details, then perhaps you are correct. But if you don`t have that access, then I remain sceptical.
_________________
Support Dunfermline Athletic Disabled Supporters` Club (DADSC) when you shop online with one of 8000 firms: https://www.easyfundraising.org.uk/causes/dadsc[
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Topic Originator: DunPar
Date: Mon 30 Sep 16:50
How much did Craig Whyte pay for Rangers ? £1 ?
Maybe we could all get the collection buckets out and see if we can collect the same !
Over 40 years ago I won the Daily Express letter of the week for suggesting a 16 team league. I’m not really sure it would improve Scottish league attendances. Probably not ours. What about a 14 team league and a mid season split to 7. 26+12 games.
Home supports for games against the OF are abysmal nowadays. I still remember the “Eric Ferguson” game when we had nearly 20,000 in EEP. Sad to hear ideas of our 11,000 capacity ground being too big. Back in the day, there were plans to build a new 20,000 stadium at Pitreavie ! Some of us thought that lacked ambition!! But how many times this century have we had more than 10,000 (never mind capacity) at EEP ?
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Topic Originator: buffy
Date: Mon 30 Sep 17:19
There were a couple of volunteers unwell at the weekend which is why AB was selling half time tickets.
”Buffy’s Buns are the finest in Fife”, J. Spence 2019”
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Topic Originator: cammypar 1995
Date: Mon 30 Sep 17:26
Quote:
da_no_1, Mon 30 Sept 16:10
Quote:
cammypar 1995, Mon 30 Sept 15:04
Quote:
da_no_1, Mon 30 Sept 13:39
Quote:
wee eck, Mon 30 Sept 13:17
Have you seen his payslip?
Of course he hasn`t! But he kens a boy in Raffles who has
Wouldn`t see me in there. At least you`re consistent with offering absolutely nothing worthwhile to any conversation I`ve got to give you that.
No point whatsoever conversing with folk like you.
Although you always reply to my posts? A very interesting take for someone who can`t hold a reasonable conversation about any subject on here apart from silly school girl patter but if that`s your level who are we to judge.
c'mon the pars
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Topic Originator: DBP
Date: Mon 30 Sep 17:36
To answer an earlier post, EEP is the the middle of a residential area (unlike Falkirk) so you couldn’t use it for regular events due to noise
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Topic Originator: da_no_1
Date: Mon 30 Sep 18:15
Quote:
cammypar 1995, Mon 30 Sept 17:26
Quote:
da_no_1, Mon 30 Sept 16:10
Quote:
cammypar 1995, Mon 30 Sept 15:04
Quote:
da_no_1, Mon 30 Sept 13:39
Quote:
wee eck, Mon 30 Sept 13:17
Have you seen his payslip?
Of course he hasn`t! But he kens a boy in Raffles who has
Wouldn`t see me in there. At least you`re consistent with offering absolutely nothing worthwhile to any conversation I`ve got to give you that.
No point whatsoever conversing with folk like you.
Although you always reply to my posts? A very interesting take for someone who can`t hold a reasonable conversation about any subject on here apart from silly school girl patter but if that`s your level who are we to judge.
The thing is, and you`ll see this if you actually read most of my posts, I can. It`s easier to converse with folk who post sensible rational comments. Really easy actually.
I just can`t believe you know our marketing managers salary. If you have conclusive evidence then post it. If you don`t, then apologise for wasting everyone`s time.
Then I`ll converse with you. Until then I`ll keep calling posts like yours out for what they are, when appropriate.
"Some days will stay a 1000 years, some pass like the flash of a spark"
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Topic Originator: cammypar 1995
Date: Mon 30 Sep 18:27
Quote:
da_no_1, Mon 30 Sept 18:15
Quote:
cammypar 1995, Mon 30 Sept 17:26
Quote:
da_no_1, Mon 30 Sept 16:10
Quote:
cammypar 1995, Mon 30 Sept 15:04
Quote:
da_no_1, Mon 30 Sept 13:39
Quote:
wee eck, Mon 30 Sept 13:17
Have you seen his payslip?
Of course he hasn`t! But he kens a boy in Raffles who has
Wouldn`t see me in there. At least you`re consistent with offering absolutely nothing worthwhile to any conversation I`ve got to give you that.
No point whatsoever conversing with folk like you.
Although you always reply to my posts? A very interesting take for someone who can`t hold a reasonable conversation about any subject on here apart from silly school girl patter but if that`s your level who are we to judge.
The thing is, and you`ll see this if you actually read most of my posts, I can. It`s easier to converse with folk who post sensible rational comments. Really easy actually.
I just can`t believe you know our marketing managers salary. If you have conclusive evidence then post it. If you don`t, then apologise for wasting everyone`s time.
Then I`ll converse with you. Until then I`ll keep calling posts like yours out for what they are, when appropriate.
Believe what you will but back to the original point it was good to see the commercial manager stepping up to sell tickets with volunteers not well. Although quite disappointing to hear the hospitality wasn`t full and no ball sponsor.
c'mon the pars
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Topic Originator: da_no_1
Date: Mon 30 Sep 18:45
So in short, no.
Thanks for that.
"Some days will stay a 1000 years, some pass like the flash of a spark"
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Topic Originator: NMCmassive
Date: Mon 30 Sep 19:32
Mind when Hearts tried to turn Tyncastle into a multi-events arena? Wrecked the pitch and added to the the clubs financial issues…
I think the club is already renting out the office space that they have available 🤷🏻♂️
COYP
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Topic Originator: veteraneastender
Date: Mon 30 Sep 20:02
Quote:
veteraneastender, Mon 30 Sep 12:13
SeasonedPar,
No guarantee that we would qualify for the top tier though.
"That has to be the ambition. For football and money reasons."
Sadly, ambition and reality often diverge.
We haven`t recovered from the demise of 2014 - exacerbated by the Peter Grant experience.
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Topic Originator: Dave_1885
Date: Mon 30 Sep 22:53
Quote:
veteraneastender, Mon 30 Sep 20:02
Quote:
veteraneastender, Mon 30 Sep 12:13
SeasonedPar,
No guarantee that we would qualify for the top tier though.
"That has to be the ambition. For football and money reasons."
Sadly, ambition and reality often diverge.
We haven`t recovered from the demise of 2014 - exacerbated by the Peter Grant experience.
To be fair, the “James McPake experience” isn’t much better……
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Topic Originator: GG Riva
Date: Tue 1 Oct 06:59
Quote:
Dave_1885, Mon 30 Sept 22:53
Quote:
veteraneastender, Mon 30 Sep 20:02
Quote:
veteraneastender, Mon 30 Sep 12:13
SeasonedPar,
No guarantee that we would qualify for the top tier though.
"That has to be the ambition. For football and money reasons."
Sadly, ambition and reality often diverge.
We haven`t recovered from the demise of 2014 - exacerbated by the Peter Grant experience.
To be fair, the “James McPake experience” isn’t much better……
You`ve omitted the Yogi Hughes experience. (A masterclass in alienating a large chunk of your playing squad.)
Not your average Sunday League player.
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Topic Originator: cammypar 1995
Date: Tue 1 Oct 07:34
Quote:
Dave_1885, Mon 30 Sept 22:53
Quote:
veteraneastender, Mon 30 Sep 20:02
Quote:
veteraneastender, Mon 30 Sep 12:13
SeasonedPar,
No guarantee that we would qualify for the top tier though.
"That has to be the ambition. For football and money reasons."
Sadly, ambition and reality often diverge.
We haven`t recovered from the demise of 2014 - exacerbated by the Peter Grant experience.
To be fair, the “James McPake experience” isn’t much better……
Were worse off now that we were under the Peter grant days. Under grant we scored goals and got out of the Betfred cup group both of which mcpake has struggled with.
c'mon the pars
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Topic Originator: SeasonedPar
Date: Tue 1 Oct 08:32
Quote:
veteraneastender, Mon 30 Sep 20:02
Quote:
veteraneastender, Mon 30 Sep 12:13
SeasonedPar,
No guarantee that we would qualify for the top tier though.
"That has to be the ambition. For football and money reasons."
Sadly, ambition and reality often diverge.
We haven`t recovered from the demise of 2014 - exacerbated by the Peter Grant experience.
I’d agree. That’s why I said this HAS to be the ambition. Realistically, a longer term aim atm.
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Topic Originator: parathletic
Date: Tue 1 Oct 11:09
Peter Grant didn`t do a good job and shouldn`t have got it in the first place but he was only here for 12 league games.We had worse sequences of results under Crawford.Most of the players Grant signed were then offered new deals by subsequent managers.
If we are still suffering from a 3 month spell years on, it says more about the infrastructure of the club than Grant imo.
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Topic Originator: Dave_1885
Date: Tue 1 Oct 12:51
Quote:
GG Riva, Tue 1 Oct 06:59
Quote:
Dave_1885, Mon 30 Sept 22:53
Quote:
veteraneastender, Mon 30 Sep 20:02
Quote:
veteraneastender, Mon 30 Sep 12:13
SeasonedPar,
No guarantee that we would qualify for the top tier though.
"That has to be the ambition. For football and money reasons."
Sadly, ambition and reality often diverge.
We haven`t recovered from the demise of 2014 - exacerbated by the Peter Grant experience.
To be fair, the “James McPake experience” isn’t much better……
You`ve omitted the Yogi Hughes experience. (A masterclass in alienating a large chunk of your playing squad.)
Is Yogis points per game ratio in this league now better than McPakes btw? 🤔 his win ratio may even be better now too…….
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Topic Originator: LochgellyAlbert
Date: Tue 1 Oct 13:18
Quote:
parathletic, Tue 1 Oct 11:09
Peter Grant didn`t do a good job and shouldn`t have got it in the first place but he was only here for 12 league games.We had worse sequences of results under Crawford.Most of the players Grant signed were then offered new deals by subsequent managers.
If we are still suffering from a 3 month spell years on, it says more about the infrastructure of the club than Grant imo.
Crawford only had success when Calum Davidson was with us for a short while, prior to that we were dull.
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Topic Originator: Jeffery
Date: Tue 1 Oct 13:22
If you look at Peter Grants 12 league games in charge, we won..... 7 points.
We`re not 12 games into this season yet, so looking at McPakes last 12 league games (7 at the start of this and 5 at the end of last season) we have.....8 points.
Their records are comparable. McPake 1pt better off in the league but Grant had better results in the league cup group stage.
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Topic Originator: da_no_1
Date: Tue 1 Oct 13:28
Imagine getting all dewy eyed about John "Yogi" Hughes.
Dearie me. The man is an absolute imposter of a fitba manager and an utter bawbag to boot. If he was as good as he claims to be he`d be involved in the game.
"Some days will stay a 1000 years, some pass like the flash of a spark"
Post Edited (Tue 01 Oct 13:28)
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Topic Originator: parathletic
Date: Tue 1 Oct 14:05
Quote:
Jeffery, Tue 1 Oct 13:22
If you look at Peter Grants 12 league games in charge, we won..... 7 points.
We`re not 12 games into this season yet, so looking at McPakes last 12 league games (7 at the start of this and 5 at the end of last season) we have.....8 points.
Their records are comparable. McPake 1pt better off in the league but Grant had better results in the league cup group stage.
McPake has been in the job for a couple of years and had time to build a squad too.Grant came from a part-time club during Covid and inherited what I thought was a poor squad(no keeper at all etc). We had virtually no pre-season and it must have been nigh on impossible to scout any potential players at that time.
Whoever the manager has been, our pre-season preparation has been really poor for a while. Friendlies are about fitness, but they are also helpful in building up relationships on the park and identifying your strongest side.We are into October and the manager gives the impression he still doesn`t know his strongest team-some of that is on the owners but he still has to be doing better imo.
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Topic Originator: GG Riva
Date: Tue 1 Oct 14:17
Quote:
Dave_1885, Tue 1 Oct 12:51
Quote:
GG Riva, Tue 1 Oct 06:59
Quote:
Dave_1885, Mon 30 Sept 22:53
Quote:
veteraneastender, Mon 30 Sep 20:02
Quote:
veteraneastender, Mon 30 Sep 12:13
SeasonedPar,
No guarantee that we would qualify for the top tier though.
"That has to be the ambition. For football and money reasons."
Sadly, ambition and reality often diverge.
We haven`t recovered from the demise of 2014 - exacerbated by the Peter Grant experience.
To be fair, the “James McPake experience” isn’t much better……
You`ve omitted the Yogi Hughes experience. (A masterclass in alienating a large chunk of your playing squad.)
Is Yogis points per game ratio in this league now better than McPakes btw? 🤔 his win ratio may even be better now too…….
We might even have avoided relegation if he`d kept the players onside, eh? 🤔
Not your average Sunday League player.
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Topic Originator: jake89
Date: Tue 1 Oct 14:27
It`s fair to say we`ve had our share of duds but then that`s the case at most clubs. The trick is to sometimes stand by a manager through a tough period rather than chuck and hope to hire someone better.
In terms of sale of the club, I`d imagine the Germans would take a low-ball offer. If we get relegated, I would imagine we`d be joining ICT entering administration.
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Topic Originator: da_no_1
Date: Tue 1 Oct 15:05
Quote:
jake89, Tue 1 Oct 14:27
It`s fair to say we`ve had our share of duds but then that`s the case at most clubs. The trick is to sometimes stand by a manager through a tough period rather than chuck and hope to hire someone better.
In terms of sale of the club, I`d imagine the Germans would take a low-ball offer. If we get relegated, I would imagine we`d be joining ICT entering administration.
Limited as my knowledge is, but would administration even be an option for us? I thought our debt was all owed to Gmbh?
"Some days will stay a 1000 years, some pass like the flash of a spark"
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Topic Originator: jake89
Date: Tue 1 Oct 15:46
Quote:
da_no_1, Tue 1 Oct 15:05
Quote:
jake89, Tue 1 Oct 14:27
It`s fair to say we`ve had our share of duds but then that`s the case at most clubs. The trick is to sometimes stand by a manager through a tough period rather than chuck and hope to hire someone better.
In terms of sale of the club, I`d imagine the Germans would take a low-ball offer. If we get relegated, I would imagine we`d be joining ICT entering administration.
Limited as my knowledge is, but would administration even be an option for us? I thought our debt was all owed to Gmbh?
Isn`t there around £8m historic debt as well? I can`t imagine the club is currently solvent.
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Topic Originator: KirklistonPar
Date: Tue 1 Oct 16:06
Have we to pay that 8 million back?
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Topic Originator: DA-go Par Adonis
Date: Tue 1 Oct 17:04
The historic debt is irrelevant to the present situation - other than for the purposes of offsetting an annual profit to eliminate corporation tax.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I love it when we go sell Kevin Nisbet,
He's gonna pay for everyone this season.
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Topic Originator: P
Date: Tue 1 Oct 18:15
Quote:
da_no_1, Tue 1 Oct 15:05
Quote:
jake89, Tue 1 Oct 14:27
It`s fair to say we`ve had our share of duds but then that`s the case at most clubs. The trick is to sometimes stand by a manager through a tough period rather than chuck and hope to hire someone better.
In terms of sale of the club, I`d imagine the Germans would take a low-ball offer. If we get relegated, I would imagine we`d be joining ICT entering administration.
Limited as my knowledge is, but would administration even be an option for us? I thought our debt was all owed to Gmbh?
Which would make it unsecured and unable to put us into administration…..they could however convert to shares (dunno if that option expired though) and presumably as owner sell off what there is for spare parts
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Topic Originator: Dave_1885
Date: Tue 1 Oct 19:09
Quote:
da_no_1, Tue 1 Oct 13:28
Imagine getting all dewy eyed about John "Yogi" Hughes.
Dearie me. The man is an absolute imposter of a fitba manager and an utter bawbag to boot. If he was as good as he claims to be he`d be involved in the game.
I don’t think anyones getting “dewy eyed” about him 😂 people are just comparing factual stats between managers that is all.
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Topic Originator: Jeffery
Date: Tue 1 Oct 20:32
Quote:
Jeffery, Tue 1 Oct 13:22
If you look at Peter Grants 12 league games in charge, we won..... 7 points.
We`re not 12 games into this season yet, so looking at McPakes last 12 league games (7 at the start of this and 5 at the end of last season) we have.....8 points.
Their records are comparable. McPake 1pt better off in the league but Grant had better results in the league cup group stage.
Just to add to my post above, Hughes managed 12 points in his last 12 games.
I would never ever want him to be our manager again but that`s not too bad when you hold it up against McPake and Grants records over the same 12 game period.
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Topic Originator: cammypar 1995
Date: Tue 1 Oct 20:43
Quote:
Jeffery, Tue 1 Oct 20:32
Quote:
Jeffery, Tue 1 Oct 13:22
If you look at Peter Grants 12 league games in charge, we won..... 7 points.
We`re not 12 games into this season yet, so looking at McPakes last 12 league games (7 at the start of this and 5 at the end of last season) we have.....8 points.
Their records are comparable. McPake 1pt better off in the league but Grant had better results in the league cup group stage.
Just to add to my post above, Hughes managed 12 points in his last 12 games.
I would never ever want him to be our manager again but that`s not too bad when you hold it up against McPake and Grants records over the same 12 game period.
Think it`s a valid point to compare how the current manager compares to others who have been released from their duties in the past for doing a similar job.
c'mon the pars
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Topic Originator: GG Riva
Date: Wed 2 Oct 06:55
Quote:
cammypar 1995, Tue 1 Oct 20:43
Quote:
Jeffery, Tue 1 Oct 20:32
Quote:
Jeffery, Tue 1 Oct 13:22
If you look at Peter Grants 12 league games in charge, we won..... 7 points.
We`re not 12 games into this season yet, so looking at McPakes last 12 league games (7 at the start of this and 5 at the end of last season) we have.....8 points.
Their records are comparable. McPake 1pt better off in the league but Grant had better results in the league cup group stage.
Just to add to my post above, Hughes managed 12 points in his last 12 games.
I would never ever want him to be our manager again but that`s not too bad when you hold it up against McPake and Grants records over the same 12 game period.
Think it`s a valid point to compare how the current manager compares to others who have been released from their duties in the past for doing a similar job.
Using 12 games is arguably too small a sample to have any validity, but restricted by Grant`s inclusion. If he`s left out, Hughes and McPake could be compared more meaningfully by calculating their points per game ratio in the Championship, if any statto can be bothered. 🙄
My earlier point about us probably avoiding relegation if Hughes hadn`t alienated a large chunk of his squad is difficult to argue with. Not saying it would have been easy, but if everyone was rowing in unison.......🤔
Not your average Sunday League player.
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Topic Originator: parathletic
Date: Wed 2 Oct 11:46
Championship record with us
Hughes played 24 and gained 28 points@ 1.1666 points per game
McPake played 43 and 49 points@ 1.139 points per game
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Topic Originator: GG Riva
Date: Wed 2 Oct 12:13
Quote:
parathletic, Wed 2 Oct 11:46
Championship record with us
Hughes played 24 and gained 28 points@ 1.1666 points per game
McPake played 43 and 49 points@ 1.139 points per game
Thanks, parathletic. Neither`s record is much to write home about and confirms my conviction that I never want to see JH back as manager. The mitigating factor in McPake`s case is that he`s lost several key players for long spells because of injuries, both last season and this. Hughes, on the other hand, is a complete bawbag, as da no 1 so elegantly put it. 😃
What is undoubtedly clear is that results and performances need to improve, starting on Saturday or the pressure on the manager will become intense. We badly need a couple of wins on the board.
Not your average Sunday League player.
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Topic Originator: alwaysaPar
Date: Wed 2 Oct 12:27
Quote:
GG Riva, Wed 2 Oct 12:13
Quote:
parathletic, Wed 2 Oct 11:46
Championship record with us
Hughes played 24 and gained 28 points@ 1.1666 points per game
McPake played 43 and 49 points@ 1.139 points per game
Thanks, parathletic. Neither`s record is much to write home about and confirms my conviction that I never want to see JH back as manager. The mitigating factor in McPake`s case is that he`s lost several key players for long spells because of injuries, both last season and this. Hughes, on the other hand, is a complete bawbag, as da no 1 so elegantly put it. 😃
What is undoubtedly clear is that results and performances need to improve, starting on Saturday or the pressure on the manager will become intense. We badly need a couple of wins on the board.
Will become intense??
I tend to think it`s past that stage ....
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Topic Originator: parathletic
Date: Wed 2 Oct 12:31
Quote:
GG Riva, Wed 2 Oct 12:13
Quote:
parathletic, Wed 2 Oct 11:46
Championship record with us
Hughes played 24 and gained 28 points@ 1.1666 points per game
McPake played 43 and 49 points@ 1.139 points per game
Thanks, parathletic. Neither`s record is much to write home about and confirms my conviction that I never want to see JH back as manager. The mitigating factor in McPake`s case is that he`s lost several key players for long spells because of injuries, both last season and this. Hughes, on the other hand, is a complete bawbag, as da no 1 so elegantly put it. 😃
What is undoubtedly clear is that results and performances need to improve, starting on Saturday or the pressure on the manager will become intense. We badly need a couple of wins on the board.
No problem.I think you can breathe easy, I probably have more chance of getting the job than Hughes coming back😀I never wanted him here in the first place.
We need to try and get a settled team now as much as injuries allow and try and push on.Even though we have conceded poor goals at times, we have only conceded 4 more than the teams at the top.Four goals in 7 games for us at the other end isn`t going to get the job done though.
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Topic Originator: Jeffery
Date: Wed 2 Oct 12:34
Re: using the `last 12 games`, I looked at it as someone mentioned it above and it seems a reasonable period to look at when evaluating how a manager is performing. Nobody is going to be let go having won 12 games in a row...
I think under the present manager we have had a reasonably `normal` rate (whatever that is) of injury during that period.
I`d agree earlier in the campaign last season, when we had an entire first team sitting in the stand. That was exceptional and unmanageable for anyone, but not over the last 12.
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