|
|
Topic Originator: rudeboy69
Date: Fri 1 Aug 18:59
I live in West Lothian and travel with my daughter (now 9) to watch the pars at EEP around 50% of the home games (for various reasons).
For 4 seasons, my daughter has had an U12 season ticket, and I just buy individual tickets for whenever we attend games at East End Park.
Today I went to EEP with my daughter to show them that she was in fact under 12 and to pick up her season ticket (purchased in May)
I was informed than they no longer sell season tickets to under 12s unless there is an adult buying a season ticket as well.
As we attend just over half the home games, this makes having a full season ticket a waste of money for me. If there was a 10 game option I would take it but there isn`t.
After a back and forward discussion where I informed them it is not possible for my daughter to come alone and she always attends with me as a paying adult, the club still refused to sell me her season ticket.
At roughly £1.50/game for her its worth me bringing her but if i am now going to be charged 8/9 quid a game then it simply may change how often bring her.
If this decision stays, then the cost to me bringing my daughter will increase by £60-70 a season. For a girl with no interest in football (but getting the pars bug), this is potentially us losing a future fan (and exponentially if she has family in the future). This also means she probably won`t want the 2 or 3 tops a season (she wanted last year) and the sausage roll at games, further losing the club money.
The club used safe guarding as an excuse but seemed to not show understanding as to how a 9 year old who lives 30 minutes drive away is going to be unsafe and attend alone.
It is unfortunate that other fans have tried to rip off the club through inappropriate season ticket use. However, this is a truly stupid decision the club has made to ban under 12s instead of not checking those entering with an u12 ST are of the required age and with an adult.
I am waiting for the club shop manager to phone me to discuss this but I feel the lack of foresight will become a stumbling block for us to get any resolution.
I can`t be the only person in this position and I do feel strongly the club need to address this.
Sorry for the rant
COYP
FRANK THE TANK FRANK THE TANK
|
|
|
|
|
|
Topic Originator: Dave_1885
Date: Fri 1 Aug 19:07
I took my 4 1/2 year old along to the Stirling game last week. Thought would be wise as a lower crowd and a bit easier to access etc. she was very excited to meet Sammy the Tammy…..wasn’t there. Then the kids fan zone was non existent as well.
I understand it was a cup game v lower league opposition, but feel like for our first Saturday 3pm game the experience was a bit meh for her.
She lasted the full game, which was promising, but the lack of things pre game may have soured it.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Topic Originator: rudeboy69
Date: Fri 1 Aug 19:09
Quote:
Dave_1885, Fri 1 Aug 19:07
I took my 4 1/2 year old along to the Stirling game last week. Thought would be wise as a lower crowd and a bit easier to access etc. she was very excited to meet Sammy the Tammy…..wasn’t there. Then the kids fan zone was non existent as well.
I understand it was a cup game v lower league opposition, but feel like for our first Saturday 3pm game the experience was a bit meh for her.
She lasted the full game, which was promising, but the lack of things pre game may have soured it.
I have persevered with my daughter and this is season 5. She now enjoys it but its taken some hard yards (especially when she went a full calendar year without seeing a win under McPake).
Keep at it
FRANK THE TANK FRANK THE TANK
|
|
|
|
|
|
Topic Originator: fcda
Date: Fri 1 Aug 19:17
When a u12 ticket is purchased does it have to be next to the adult ticket? Just wondering if a mate with a season ticket could buy it on your behalf?
Post Edited (Fri 01 Aug 19:17)
|
|
|
|
|
|
Topic Originator: rudeboy69
Date: Fri 1 Aug 19:23
Quote:
fcda, Fri 1 Aug 19:17
When a u12 ticket is purchased does it have to be next to the adult ticket? Just wondering if a mate with a season ticket could buy it on your behalf?
So yes they could attach the season ticket to another adult BUT that just renders the whole situation pointless.
They simply just need to only allow an u12 entry if they are physically with an adult.
Like everything DAFC we just make life difficult without thinking through simple solutions
FRANK THE TANK FRANK THE TANK
|
|
|
|
|
|
Topic Originator: NMCmassive
Date: Sat 2 Aug 00:38
Just to play devils advocate!!!!
I can kinda see what the club are saying. One of the only ways they’ve got to make sure an adult doesn’t buy an U12 ticket for themselves is to stipulate that to buy an U12 ST it’s to be bought in conjunction with an adult ST. Even then it won’t be 100% successful.
I really do also see your point of view and trying to keep football as affordable as possible 🤷🏻♂️ it’s a loose loose situation for everyone
COYP
|
|
|
|
|
|
Topic Originator: GG Riva
Date: Sat 2 Aug 06:53
That`s no rant, Rudeboy, more a heartfelt, impassioned plea. The club employee you dealt with is quite new to the post, I believe, and was just following instructions.
I suggest you email Drew Main, the Pars SLO, who I`m sure will be able to sort this out for you. Only 2 Scottish clubs can risk alienating future fans, and the Pars isn`t one of them.
Andrew@dafc.co.uk
Not your average Sunday League player.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Topic Originator: parsmad68
Date: Sat 2 Aug 07:31
Reminds me of the McDonald situation where a certain food must come with everything despite whether you want it or not. No flexibility in a world where software rules what people can buy.
In answer to your question. Are the Pars turning away future fans, the answer is an unequivocal yes.
The issue of adults buying children’s seasons tickets is separate and should be dealt with as such.
In an electronic age there is every possibility to link your purchased ticket to a season ticket. So if you don’t go, your child ticket is automatically invalid. There are other scenarios that could be played with different circumstances but the club have went for a minimum viable product instead of exploring all potential scenarios and options. I.e. they are maximising their profits against flexibility. This is a club decision but again answers your question that there are scenarios where they are turning away potential future fans.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Topic Originator: Never10yairds
Date: Sat 2 Aug 07:33
I’d like to buy my son a season ticket but due to working down south, offshore and abroad I won’t be buying one myself as I’ll miss too many games to make it worthwhile. I do have the option of buying my boys season ticket next to my parents tho and they might even take him when I’m not here. If it weren’t for my parents having season tickets I’d be in the same boat as you.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Topic Originator: stoo61
Date: Sat 2 Aug 07:44
Wandered in due to the extreme thread title and tbh the main thing im surprised about (as a non parent) is that the club ever sold U12 tickets on their own. I had always assumed £21 was a massive deal for a full season ticket holder only. A good deal for the ST holder and the club.
I see no upside for the club to block a seat for an entire season for £21 without a full price ticket alongside. Drawn to its logical (and admittedly improbable) conclusion you could end up with thousands of seats blocked and empty most weeks.
Seems to me like the club may be getting a little more professional on the ticketing side of things. Stamping out the misuse of tickets especially by those who clearly want to take from the club by purchasing a cheaper ticket than they are entitled to. (Not suggesting the OP is doing that whatsoever but clearly some people are and have been for years)
I understand those who have, in past, been able to purchase an U12 ticket on its own might be perturbed but seems like the correct and dare I say it obvious decision for a business with a sellable asset to make and not only that, they`ve created a huge saving for full season ticket holders with children. Win win.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Topic Originator: oapar
Date: Sat 2 Aug 07:46
Turning fans away is the exact opposite of what the club are trying to achieve right now.
When the free u12 season tickets were introduced the rule was, that they had to be purchased with an adult/concession season ticket. Unfortunately over time, the rules were ignored by some people selling tickets and a new way of selling u12 tickets emerged, allowing an u12 season tickets to be sold without the purchase of an adult/concession season ticket at the same time.
The club is trying to run a professional business and the safety aspect, is one concern. If the tickets are not purchased at the same time, there is no guarantee that the u12 would be seated next to a responsible adult.
This has probably come to light when the season ticket purchasing regulations were reviewed, following the discovery of the number of season tickets that were purchased incorrectly.
Any anger should maybe not be directed at the club, but at those who have `made mistakes` whilst purchasing their tickets, and costing the club valuable income.
Post Edited (Sat 02 Aug 07:51)
|
|
|
|
|
|
Topic Originator: DJAS
Date: Sat 2 Aug 08:18
I remember having to take my boys birth certificates with me for proof. I assume that hasn’t been done for a while.
Predictor league winner 2012/2013
|
|
|
|
|
|
Topic Originator: P
Date: Sat 2 Aug 08:27
Buying a full season ticket does not guarantee it will be used together at the point of entry as suggested by the workaround above. The club has put a control in at the gate to prevent unaccompanied entry so the duty of care is met.
A child season ticket doesn’t lead to a seat next to it being blocked out and let’s face it there is zero chance a parent child would not be able to find unallocated seats together elsewhere.
I cannot justify a season book for myself as I miss too many games. My wife and I split taking him when able.
The unintended consequences;
- If his ticket is not valid we will simply get a refund,
- without that ‘hook’ to take him to games there’s every chance we will do other things (my wife will absolutely do anything other than go to a match if not for the season ticket) so all of our adult tickets will be lost.
- If he’s not going to matches I might as well take the new shirt back as he trains with academies & teams where kit is provided.
- I am fighting a battle to prevent him supporting a ‘big’ club already and this keeps him connected
- Football attendance is a habit, when you get out of the habit it’s harder to go back regularly
- his connection to the club will dilute & eventually disappear
Other than all that sounds a brilliant idea to grow our long term fan base
|
|
|
|
|
|
Topic Originator: Par
Date: Sat 2 Aug 08:31
Is there not going to be a separate gate/check for concessions, therefore the ticket can still be bought but access denied if the U12 turns up on matchday without a full paying adult.
While undoubtedly following rules surely every employee of the club should be fans focused and come up with a solution no matter how new they are, it would be clear when purchasing the ones who are trying to abuse the system.
Post Edited (Sat 02 Aug 08:35)
|
|
|
|
|
|
Topic Originator: stoo61
Date: Sat 2 Aug 08:57
£21 season tickets doing a lot of heavy lifting, it seems. If its not £1.50 a match, better take up crazy golf or whatever.
The club would like fans to accept an excellent ST holder deal or pay £10 a match for their U12`s on the odd occasion they get the time or even the inclination to pop along.
There will be a myriad of different scenarios across a range of fans but the deal is a fair one and should have always been implemented IMO.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Topic Originator: rudeboy69
Date: Sat 2 Aug 09:03
Thanks for the replies.
I can understand some of the points who have sided with the club but I think at this stage in DAFC journey I have to disagree.
The club very rarely if never sells out so that seat being blocked is irrelevant due to having a stadium bigger than we need.
If the club however wanted the seat to be made available when not used they could easily set up a "give your seat back to be re-sold" option (like falkirk, hearts rangers do) however its not necessary.
If the club is only offering these cheap tickets to encourage adult season tickets and are trying to maximise income then that is everything wrong with the club. The club needs to build a fan base rather than try and maximise taking money for kids who let`s be honest have little interest.
Regarding not being sitted together. In last few years of her having a season ticket this has never happened even with big crowds against Hamilton, wee team etc.
After writing this I checked and we attend 11 games last year.
My ticket- £220
Child ticket- £20
Club shop- £150
Kiosk-£50ish
This figure will be significantly lower this year if Instead of a child season ticket I need to pay £8 for my daughter every week. Does this make good financial sense from the club?
If the club is trying to become more professional then crack on, however we should be doing everything possible to get more people through the door rather than alienating fans over small amounts of money.
FRANK THE TANK FRANK THE TANK
|
|
|
|
|
|
Topic Originator: jake89
Date: Sat 2 Aug 09:04
Surely all that needs done is a check that an u12 is with an adult? My kids are under 12. I could buy a season ticket and get a couple for them. That would be fine. But what if I then say "I can`t be bothered today" and they go on their own? Who`s checking?
Surely if this is related to safety they need a specific gate for families/carers so they can confirm a child is with an adult?
|
|
|
|
|
|
Topic Originator: alwaysaPar
Date: Sat 2 Aug 09:59
Or have a separate price for an under 12 ticket that is bought without an adult ticket based on the stipulation that an under 12 must still attend with an adult.....
|
|
|
|
|
|
Topic Originator: gwh18
Date: Sat 2 Aug 10:04
Dunfermline are always reactive never proactive. Seen a lot of clubs did this last season and now Dunfermline have went on trend. I work weekends and had an U12 season ticket for my boy. But paid on the day for myself, so I see where the poster is coming from. Sometimes looking at the weather, it was only the fact the ticket was there, that stopped the boy being dragged to some soulless central belt shopping centre.by his mother. There is enough stewards kicking about to deal with a dedicated gate for u12’s checking for misuse and the presence of an adult.Or are they only employed to walk up a staircase at the same time ? Just a thought With no evidence to back it up, maybe it is part of the move for wider alcohol license after the pilot scheme ?
|
|
|
|
|
|
Topic Originator: Taxipar
Date: Sat 2 Aug 10:45
Problem is adults scamming U12 cards to get cheap entry, every season ticket should have a photo of the person like in other sports and that would be picked up by the scanners, all be it the scanners would need a update
A par since 1985
|
|
|
|
|
|
Topic Originator: jake89
Date: Sat 2 Aug 10:58
What would be stopping me going to the likes of Raith and reserving a dozen u12 season tickets?
|
|
|
|
|
|
Topic Originator: coventrypar
Date: Sat 2 Aug 11:05
If someone isn’t a season ticket holder themselves why should that be rewarded for say attending 8 or 9 games a season to allow you to purchase a ridiculously cheap season ticket for your kid.
It’s a deal to encourage adult season ticket sales so it becomes affordable to bring your kids/grandkids.
If you add in say one adult and 2 kids versus the same paying on the day the saving is huge even if you only attend 2/3rds of games.
"If you have no kind words to say you should say nothing more at all"
|
|
|
|
|
|
Topic Originator: rudeboy69
Date: Sat 2 Aug 11:38
Quote:
coventrypar, Sat 2 Aug 11:05
If someone isn’t a season ticket holder themselves, why should that be rewarded for saying attending 8 or 9 games a season to allow you to purchase a ridiculously cheap season ticket for your kid.
It’s a deal to encourage adult season ticket sales so it becomes affordable to bring your kids/grandkids.
If you add in say one adult and 2 kids versus the same paying on the day the saving is huge even if you only attend 2/3rds of games.
I had a season ticket for over 20 years prior to my daughter being born. Maybe some people don`t have the luxury of football every week. Walk up supporters are important to provide income throughout the year and pay a higher rate of entry for not purchasing the ST. If there was a 10 game option I would be all over it but its all or nothing.
To answer your question of "why should you get a cheap ST for u12s"
To encourage fans for the future?
To make it affordable to get bums on seats in a stadium that is, most of the time, half empty?
To get kids out of the house?
Going to football is ridiculously priced, and people go mostly because of habit and blind loyalty. If we do not encourage kids to come, then the blind loyalty fans won`t be there in the future. It is a very easy habit to get out of, and so clubs should be doing everything they can to avoid this.
FRANK THE TANK FRANK THE TANK
|
|
|
|
|
|
Topic Originator: GG Riva
Date: Sat 2 Aug 12:45
^^^^^^ Good post, rudeboy. ^^^^^^^
Not your average Sunday League player.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Topic Originator: Westies squint kicks
Date: Sat 2 Aug 13:22
Under 18 season tickets must be some of the best value available in Football, I don`t think they are priced at £58 to encourage the parents of said Under 18`s to buy a season ticket.
Maybe the answer is if no adult season ticket is bought alongside an Under 12 season ticket then instead of selling a seat to the Under 12 you provide a voucher book that enables a parent/carer when buying a single match ticket to exchange a voucher for an Under 12 match ticket. Here no unused seats will be idle and the Under 12 will still have to pass the gate age test.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Topic Originator: ohaye
Date: Sat 2 Aug 13:30
I was in the same situation yesterday. Was in buying my son both full home & away kits & asked to renew the kids season ticket he’s had for the last 3 years but was told it’s no longer policy to sell kids season tickets without an accompanying adult one. He’s probably attended a handful of games over the last couple of season but this last few months has been showing more interest in going & for the first time actually knows when the season starts.
Unfortunately can’t justify one for myself as miss too many games & don’t really have a desire to pay £8 a game for a 7 year old on top of my adult ticket, which means we’ll likely not attend many if any this season.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Topic Originator: rudeboy69
Date: Sat 2 Aug 13:32
Quote:
Westies squint kicks, Sat 2 Aug 13:22
Under 18 season tickets must be some of the best value available in Football, I don`t think they are priced at £58 to encourage the parents of said Under 18`s to buy a season ticket.
Maybe the answer is if no adult season ticket is bought alongside an Under 12 season ticket then instead of selling a seat to the Under 12 you provide a voucher book that enables a parent/carer when buying a single match ticket to exchange a voucher for an Under 12 match ticket. Here no unused seats will be idle and the Under 12 will still have to pass the gate age test.
There are many solutions the club have however just hastily come up with a decision without thinking of the consequences.
FRANK THE TANK FRANK THE TANK
|
|
|
|
|
|
Topic Originator: rudeboy69
Date: Sat 2 Aug 13:33
Quote:
ohaye, Sat 2 Aug 13:30
I was in the same situation yesterday. Was in buying my son both full home & away kits & asked to renew the kids season ticket he’s had for the last 3 years but was told it’s no longer policy to sell kids season tickets without an accompanying adult one. He’s probably attended a handful of games over the last couple of season but this last few months has been showing more interest in going & for the first time actually knows when the season starts.
Unfortunately can’t justify one for myself as miss too many games & don’t really have a desire to pay £8 a game for a 7 year old on top of my adult ticket, which means we’ll likely not attend many if any this season.
I am sorry to hear you`re in the same position.
I have emailed the SLO and still waiting to speak with shop manager. Hopefully a solution can be found.
FRANK THE TANK FRANK THE TANK
|
|
|
|
|
|
