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Topic Originator: GG Riva
Date: Sun 17 May 12:41
All football fans know they`re not allowed on the pitch. Whether it`s harmless, joyous celebrations, or it has a more sinister intent is largely irrelevant. Drastic action is required because clubs aren`t going to do anything about it, and so the idiots in their fan bases will continue to invade the pitches.
The only way to stop it is to close the stadium of the club whose fans invade the pitch. A one match ban for a first offence, increasing for repeat offences. That would soon put a stop to ugly and embarrassing scenes like yesterday`s at Celtic Park.
Not your average Sunday League player.
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Topic Originator: da_no_1
Date: Sun 17 May 12:49
There`s millions of them who`ve never been near Glasgow and never will.
Deducting points is the only thing that would hurt them all.
"Some days will stay a 1000 years, some pass like the flash of a spark"
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Topic Originator: Tenruh
Date: Sun 17 May 12:54
What`s the outcome of the Celtic / Newgers invasion a few months ago?
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Topic Originator: thebear
Date: Sun 17 May 13:45
Regarding the last one, sfa have agreed an independant investigation, it`s a farce watch the TV, does not need it, take action now.
Regarding yesterday`s, the match did not complete, so should be replayed.
Also how was the hearts ticket allocation agreed
The fans behaviour on the pitch was appalling, threatening players and fans, not just minor threats, so bad tgat players had to be protected and the hearts team left the ground early as the threat level was too high.
And the trongate in glasgow major troubles, in effect rioting that need substantial police to control, police funded by you and I that could be out there stopping other crimes.
And then even worse, martin O`Neil a man I used to respect, could only say If there was threatening behavior, he was against it. IF Martin IF, open your eyes, it was there in front of you.
What should happen now
If match genuinely did not finish and there is proof on tv, it should be replayed or perhaps awarded to Hearts.
Celtic officials, perhaps hearts as well should view the match tines and post match scenes then react very hard and punish celtic by banning fans from next number of matches 6 in my eyes.
Celtic should be given a massive fine.
Perhaps deducted points from next year`s league.
Police should refuse to police celtic matches until this is sorted.
SfA, you need to get off the fence. Stop backing up the old form and be hard on them, what would you do if it was another team premiership or not you would react, but now you ignore and brush it under the table in the hope that the furore subsides.
Sadly scotland football is a joke, run by 2 big teams and an sfa that are scared ir are pro the issues.
Post Edited (Sun 17 May 13:45)
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Topic Originator: summeragent
Date: Sun 17 May 14:03
Quote:
thebear, Sun 17 May 13:45
Regarding the last one, sfa have agreed an independant investigation, it`s a farce watch the TV, does not need it, take action now.
Regarding yesterday`s, the match did not complete, so should be replayed.
Also how was the hearts ticket allocation agreed
The fans behaviour on the pitch was appalling, threatening players and fans, not just minor threats, so bad tgat players had to be protected and the hearts team left the ground early as the threat level was too high.
And the trongate in glasgow major troubles, in effect rioting that need substantial police to control, police funded by you and I that could be out there stopping other crimes.
And then even worse, martin O`Neil a man I used to respect, could only say If there was threatening behavior, he was against it. IF Martin IF, open your eyes, it was there in front of you.
What should happen now
If match genuinely did not finish and there is proof on tv, it should be replayed or perhaps awarded to Hearts.
Celtic officials, perhaps hearts as well should view the match tines and post match scenes then react very hard and punish celtic by banning fans from next number of matches 6 in my eyes.
Celtic should be given a massive fine.
Perhaps deducted points from next year`s league.
Police should refuse to police celtic matches until this is sorted.
SfA, you need to get off the fence. Stop backing up the old form and be hard on them, what would you do if it was another team premiership or not you would react, but now you ignore and brush it under the table in the hope that the furore subsides.
Sadly scotland football is a joke, run by 2 big teams and an sfa that are scared ir are pro the issues.
Post Edited (Sun 17 May 13:45)
If the match was abandoned because of the Celtic pitch invasion then Hearts should be awarded a 3-0 win?
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Topic Originator: Parfect69
Date: Sun 17 May 14:03
Quote:
Tenruh, Sun 17 May 12:54
What`s the outcome of the Celtic / Newgers invasion a few months ago?
Still under the carpet, much like what will happen as a result of yesterday’s events.
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Topic Originator: SeasonedPar
Date: Sun 17 May 14:55
The league games come under the SPFL, the Cup the SFA.
Either way, they’re not anonymous groups, but made up of representatives of each club.
Which clubs are strong enough to stand up to both sides and take the action deserved for bringing the game into disrepute?
Those of us of a certain vintage will remember Roy Barry wasn’t allowed to parade the Scottish Cup at Hampden in 1968 due to crowd trouble between that pair the year before.
So, who stands up? I won’t hold my breath either.
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Topic Originator: LochgellyAlbert
Date: Sun 17 May 15:22
One of the problems is the subs and staff invading the pitch to celebrate the goal, thus encouraging fans to do likewise.
It seems to happen a lot just now, even the Pars do it when subs are warming up.
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Topic Originator: doctordandruff
Date: Sun 17 May 16:09
That fixture happened because Celtic had 3 post split home games, and it couldn`t be Rangers as Celtic fans have a tendency to assault referees.
So it became 50/50 that Hearts would have to play the hardest match to win the league. Do we add them to the list now and Celtic cant play Hearts last game of the season either?
All fixtures should be random and if it was Celtic v Rangers the its a closed stadium. Imagine if it was an Old Firm game and Hearts were away to Motherwell yesterday? Would Celtic still be favorites.
Post Edited (Sun 17 May 16:09)
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Topic Originator: fcda
Date: Sun 17 May 16:09
Extract from SPFL post on Facebook...
[I]Given the speculation about the conclusion of the game, we would like to make clear that, prior to awarding the trophy, we were informed by the match referee that the match had ended and had not been abandoned.[/I]
So like it or not the game wasn`t abandoned.
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Topic Originator: BouncyPar
Date: Sun 17 May 16:16
Quote:
fcda, Sun 17 May 16:09
Extract from SPFL post on Facebook...
[I]Given the speculation about the conclusion of the game, we would like to make clear that, prior to awarding the trophy, we were informed by the match referee that the match had ended and had not been abandoned.[/I]
So like it or not the game wasn`t abandoned.
They were never going to turn round and openly admit tho, were they. It was only a matter of time before they worded the perfect statement absolving them of any wrongdoing
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Topic Originator: veteraneastender
Date: Sun 17 May 16:16
"Those of us of a certain vintage will remember Roy Barry wasn’t allowed to parade the Scottish Cup at Hampden in 1968 due to crowd trouble between that pair the year before."
The Celtic v Rangers trouble was two and a half years previously - not that that changes the dynamics of the ban.
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Topic Originator: dafc
Date: Sun 17 May 16:32
Part of the problem is these so called independent committees are made of club officials from other clubs and likely allegiances too, or names being released and subject to abuse. Until there is better government solutions alongside football it will escalate as it’s done over past few years, are those in charge waiting till a player is seriously injured, as that’s probably just round the corner.
England and wales apparently criminal offence to enter pitch not in Scotland, that needs to change and have a stronger deterrent, however unlikely to happen as prisons already full.
There is probably only 2 teams who’ll not allow Celtic fans in next season
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Topic Originator: thebear
Date: Sun 17 May 16:35
It was not deliberately abandoned, simply that the game stopped was too difficult to stsrt and then declared it was full time.
Absolute rubbish. Get them to release the refs microphone discussion and var, let`s compare notes. Oh it`s too late it`s been destroyed. What a f..k up by sfa/spfl, sadly again. Compare it with tv screen and commentary. The match clearly finished early, and that`s without adding on extra time before the extra .minute we`re declared.
Does not bode well for next wee.k if we win or lose for that matter.
All scottish teams need to stand up and object get them out the league, go to England or Ireland.
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Topic Originator: SeasonedPar
Date: Sun 17 May 16:39
Quote:
veteraneastender, Sun 17 May 16:16
"Those of us of a certain vintage will remember Roy Barry wasn’t allowed to parade the Scottish Cup at Hampden in 1968 due to crowd trouble between that pair the year before."
The Celtic v Rangers trouble was two and a half years previously - not that that changes the dynamics of the ban.
Correct VEE. Memory can play tricks, but you’re right, the point is stands.
Add to that 1980 old firm pitch invasion, 2017 invasion between Hibs and Rangers. I’m sure there’s others, and still it goes on and on.
Added
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Topic Originator: Dave_1885
Date: Sun 17 May 16:57
Quote:
fcda, Sun 17 May 16:09
Extract from SPFL post on Facebook...
[I]Given the speculation about the conclusion of the game, we would like to make clear that, prior to awarding the trophy, we were informed by the match referee that the match had ended and had not been abandoned.[/I]
So like it or not the game wasn`t abandoned.
Was the entire Hearts 11 on the park when the final whistle was blown? And only 11 Celtic players on the park?
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Topic Originator: Parplod
Date: Sun 17 May 17:46
You will never stop the Neanderthal element invading the pitch but Police Scotland need to have a serious look at themselves. I suspect that the Match Commander(s) at the recent cup match at Ibrox and at yesterday’s game have little awareness of football. On both occasions the dynamic of the game meant that a crowd incursion was predictable.
At Ibrox, Celtic were completely outplayed for 120 minutes and, as penalties became increasingly likely, the realisation among the fans that they could actually win was growing. Prior to penalties starting there should have been a reinforced line of yellow jackets in front of the Broomloan Stand, and another along the centre line behind the players.
Yesterday, having hopefully learnt a lesson from that Ibrox game, the line of yellow jackets should have been reinforced around the perimeter of the pitch.
Unless things have changed since my retiral, football clubs only pay for officers who are within the stadium. The charges for Police services are set by the Police Authority not Police Scotland. I remember Rangers always trying to persuade us to reduce police numbers because of the cost.
I doubt the SFA/SPFL will have the balls to sanction the clubs, so the easiest way to hit the clubs would be to insist on a significant number of officers within the stadium and less reliance on stewards. That would seriously hit them in their pocket.
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Topic Originator: Jock Par36
Date: Sun 17 May 18:03
Celtic Fc are responsible for the crowd control of fans
inside their stadium. With their fans disgusting
behaviour against Hearts, where there was trouble
inside and outside the ground and also in the City centre.
As a result of these incidents should Celtic be punished
with a ground closure for some games and maybe a
15 ptd deduction for the start of next season.
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Topic Originator: BouncyPar
Date: Sun 17 May 18:09
Over and above the responsibilities of the clubs and the police, the stewards at football matches these days are of little to no use. They wear a hivis jacket but that`s about it. There are some good ones left, but by and large they are young, with no physical presence, and little understanding of football culture.
How many Celtic fans just walked past a steward without intervention yesterday?
The police are shouldering a large amount of criticism here, but I see the stewards as the front line of in-stadia crowd control, and the standards have slipped greatly over the last 10 years or so
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Topic Originator: Raymie the Legend
Date: Sun 17 May 18:15
Quote:
Parplod, Sun 17 May 17:46
You will never stop the Neanderthal element invading the pitch but Police Scotland need to have a serious look at themselves. I suspect that the Match Commander(s) at the recent cup match at Ibrox and at yesterday’s game have little awareness of football. On both occasions the dynamic of the game meant that a crowd incursion was predictable.
At Ibrox, Celtic were completely outplayed for 120 minutes and, as penalties became increasingly likely, the realisation among the fans that they could actually win was growing. Prior to penalties starting there should have been a reinforced line of yellow jackets in front of the Broomloan Stand, and another along the centre line behind the players.
Yesterday, having hopefully learnt a lesson from that Ibrox game, the line of yellow jackets should have been reinforced around the perimeter of the pitch.
Unless things have changed since my retiral, football clubs only pay for officers who are within the stadium. The charges for Police services are set by the Police Authority not Police Scotland. I remember Rangers always trying to persuade us to reduce police numbers because of the cost.
I doubt the SFA/SPFL will have the balls to sanction the clubs, so the easiest way to hit the clubs would be to insist on a significant number of officers within the stadium and less reliance on stewards. That would seriously hit them in their pocket.
Good post. You wouldn’t need to be Einstein to suspect a pitch invasion could happen.
It`s bloody tough being a legend
Ron Atkinson - 1983
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Topic Originator: veteraneastender
Date: Sun 17 May 18:24
"Over and above the responsibilities of the clubs and the police, the stewards at football matches these days are of little to no use. They wear a hivis jacket but that`s about it. There are some good ones left, but by and large they are young, with no physical presence, and little understanding of football culture.
How many Celtic fans just walked past a steward without intervention yesterday?
The police are shouldering a large amount of criticism here, but I see the stewards as the front line of in-stadia crowd control, and the standards have slipped greatly over the last 10 years or so."
Stewards have absolutely no powers to prevent anybody from entering the pitch etc. - only the police have such "physical presence" authority.
Post Edited (Sun 17 May 18:25)
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Topic Originator: BouncyPar
Date: Sun 17 May 18:30
Quote:
veteraneastender, Sun 17 May 18:24
"Over and above the responsibilities of the clubs and the police, the stewards at football matches these days are of little to no use. They wear a hivis jacket but that`s about it. There are some good ones left, but by and large they are young, with no physical presence, and little understanding of football culture.
How many Celtic fans just walked past a steward without intervention yesterday?
The police are shouldering a large amount of criticism here, but I see the stewards as the front line of in-stadia crowd control, and the standards have slipped greatly over the last 10 years or so."
Stewards have absolutely no powers to prevent anybody from entering the pitch etc. - only the police have such "physical presence" authority.
Stewards have power to restrain someone causing a disturbance, or to prevent someone entering the field of play. They don`t have the power to arrest someone, but can physically restrain them and remove them from the ground, in the same way a doorman can physically eject someone from a pub
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Topic Originator: thebear
Date: Sun 17 May 19:46
The steward role is to help control normal crowd issues. They are not there to get into issues that put themselves at risk
That is the polices role, so dont state stewards are crap when a thug wants to come past them with feet and fists flying.
It is up to football club and police to understand crowds and risk and provide a plan and level of resources
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Topic Originator: parsmad68
Date: Sun 17 May 19:52
Why are we discussing anything other than the people who ran on the park in the first place. If they don’t come on then there are no issues. Simple.
Celtic fans told by club and by police not to congregate at the Trongate, yet they do. The time for diplomacy has passed with football and time for authorities (whoever that is) to get tough.
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Topic Originator: BouncyPar
Date: Sun 17 May 19:57
Quote:
thebear, Sun 17 May 19:46
The steward role is to help control normal crowd issues. They are not there to get into issues that put themselves at risk
That is the polices role, so dont state stewards are crap when a thug wants to come past them with feet and fists flying.
It is up to football club and police to understand crowds and risk and provide a plan and level of resources
Nobody said they were crap, just ineffective in the role they are employed to do, which by your own words is crowd control.
As far as I am aware, the vast majority of those who entered the pitch yesterday did so either by stepping over the barrier or thru the security gates. No feet or fists flying. And very few were stopped by a steward, who we`ve already agreed has a role of crowd control.
The stewards are not solely to blame, but their ineffectiveness does play a part in it.
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Topic Originator: twin par
Date: Sun 17 May 21:38
Anyone,can make a citizen arrest.
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Topic Originator: SeasonedPar
Date: Sun 17 May 22:09
Let’s not blame the stewards. Or the police. The only way is to hit the clubs involved in their pockets, and stop the income stream. No fans and no live tv of their matches for a season, while they compensate the lost revenue at away games to the home club.
Unfair on decent fans? How long has this been going on? Police, ambulance, hospitals all stretched enough.
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Topic Originator: da_no_1
Date: Sun 17 May 22:10
Say it again. Points deduction is the only thing these fuckwits will understand
"Some days will stay a 1000 years, some pass like the flash of a spark"
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Topic Originator: twin par
Date: Sun 17 May 22:32
Agree ,point deduction is the only way,which will really hit home,to club and morons.
Post Edited (Sun 17 May 22:34)
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Topic Originator: Stanza
Date: Sun 17 May 23:14
Realistically, you could have doubled the number of stewards around the pitch and some fans would still get through . Anyway, I don`t see why low-paid stewards should have to put themselves in harm`s way by grappling with adrenaline-fuelled fans, many of whom are younger, stronger and fitter than them.
Perhaps someone could devise a six-foot high net or fence that completely surrounds the pitch, but lies flat until it is deployed by the stewards or police match commander. Stewards need not try to intercept anyone, just allow them onto the pitch, deploy the net and then round up all the intruders to be handed over to the police! 😁
_________________
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Topic Originator: Big T Par
Date: Sun 17 May 23:31
Quote:
Stanza, Sun 17 May 23:14
Realistically, you could have doubled the number of stewards around the pitch and some fans would still get through . Anyway, I don`t see why low-paid stewards should have to put themselves in harm`s way by grappling with adrenaline-fuelled fans, many of whom are younger, stronger and fitter than them.
Perhaps someone could devise a six-foot high net or fence that completely surrounds the pitch, but lies flat until it is deployed by the stewards or police match commander. Stewards need not try to intercept anyone, just allow them onto the pitch, deploy the net and then round up all the intruders to be handed over to the police! 😁
Like in the original Planet Of The Apes?
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