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 Woodmill high
Topic Originator: dave67  
Date:   Sun 25 Aug 18:11

Seen posts on FB that the special unit at woodmill is on fire.

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: EEP  
Date:   Sun 25 Aug 18:14

Yeh the place is wrecked. Roof caved in.
Not the main school but I’m sure the smoke would have spread a bit.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: dave67  
Date:   Sun 25 Aug 18:22

https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/news/scottish-news/4645473/fire-dunfermline-woodmill-high-school/amp

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: JTH123  
Date:   Sun 25 Aug 18:31

Coincidence that it's the first full week back tomorrow after the holidays? Mmm I wonder...
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: GG Riva  
Date:   Sun 25 Aug 18:39

I hope it's not arson. I live a mile away and I've had to shut my windows as the smell of burning plastic is overpowering.



Not your average Sunday League player.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: dave67  
Date:   Sun 25 Aug 19:07

Old building = asbestos. Not good for the locals

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: EEP  
Date:   Sun 25 Aug 19:27

It’s the new das unit.
Looks like the fire started in the centre of the building from photos so I wonder what is there? A fire normally central is electrical.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: jake89  
Date:   Sun 25 Aug 20:34

Bunch of numpties stood on the playing fields watching it burn. Might want to think about all the plastic and what-not burning...
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: JTH123  
Date:   Sun 25 Aug 21:03

Council messaged to say school closed till further notice.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: DulochConvert  
Date:   Sun 25 Aug 21:17

The building is in huge flames again, not just the thick smoke of the last few hours.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: Sammy_Must_Die  
Date:   Sun 25 Aug 22:09

Fire is still blazing red hot, hope it doesn't spread to the main building!



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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: EEP  
Date:   Sun 25 Aug 22:26

You would think the DAS unit built onto the existing school would have the new regs stopping a fire spreading?
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: dave67  
Date:   Sun 25 Aug 22:38

It was built in the 70s

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: renegade master  
Date:   Sun 25 Aug 23:01

The new unit is where it started, the black acrid smoke suggests the insulated roof cladding was not flame retardant.
It's spread to the kitchen and canteen as they fight to save the main building.

Police saying the fire was started deliberately, tragic times!
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: EEP  
Date:   Sun 25 Aug 23:27

Just in time when my daughter has her most important year😩😩
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: doctordandruff  
Date:   Sun 25 Aug 23:42

Son just started there. I'm absolutely gutted for him and especially his friends in the DAS unit. Utterly devastating for those kids. It's licking at the main building now and burning as intense as ever. Can only hope they stop it at this point.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: renegade master  
Date:   Sun 25 Aug 23:52

Current pictures showing it has got a hold of the main building, water supply has finally been increased to help, leaving the surrounding area without water.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: davepars  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 00:01

14 year old arrested. Lit the bins and watched, then fucd off to Rajas
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: DulochConvert  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 00:08

So he will get no punishment, while our kids education is reduced and the repair bill is in the millions
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: SergioDuarte  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 05:41

Hopefully a life sentence for the ned. Sub human scum.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: GG Riva  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 07:15

Sadly, no surprise if these rumours turn out to be true. For years, the school has been like a magnet in the evenings for local kids. Running about on the flat roofs, getting down into the quad and trying to get into classrooms, was an an almost daily occurrence. On one occasion, Ì surprised some kids who had piled up paper in a classroom, obviously intending to start a fire.(I worked as a duty manager in Community Use, one evening per week.) The school janitor got into bother for daubing anti-vandal paint on a part of the building where the kids climbed up onto the roof and Fife Council paid compensation for the kids ruined clothes when their parents complained......



Not your average Sunday League player.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: dave67  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 07:17

I'm sure faye sinclair can organise some portacabins
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: Rastapari  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 07:37

Quote:

dave67, Mon 26 Aug 07:17

I'm sure faye sinclair can organise some portacabins


Has she got time away from blocking people on social media?

I Hope You're Ok Today....
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: back oh the net  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 08:49

Long shot I know but could the club not step in and offer help where possible?

Come on ye pars ⚽️
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: BigJPar  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 09:15

Having seen the photos I'd be surprised if that building ever opens again. Bit of a dilemma for the council now.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: DulochConvert  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 09:16

I think the situation is beyond that, 1500 children don’t have a school, with all Local schools full looks like they will be a lot of busses this year, then next year a lot of very angry parents across Fife.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: doctordandruff  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 09:28

From what I've seen this morning it looks like 10-20% of the main building gone and extensive smoke damage. Hopefully with St Columbas over the road they can come up with a plan for the next couple of months that means the kids can stay there.

There is just nothing locally for the kids in the DAS unit. I dont know what options they have. Commandeer the extension being built at Touch maybe

Post Edited (Mon 26 Aug 09:28)
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: Doves  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 09:42

Hopefully this will bring into focus the lack of infrastructure when houses are endlessly put up but not enough is done to accommodate incoming people and their children.

"C'est la vie", say the old folks, it goes to show you never can tell.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: jake89  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 09:50

The main concern is how a small bin fire spread so quickly. Whoever did it has potentially just ruined their life by acting an idiot.

It's been known for years that Woodmill and St Columba's needed replaced but the ScotGov have failed to come up with the cash. I think it's now being allocated but appears to be a bit late on this case.

The other concern is a lack of capacity locally. Again, this has been known about for many years now. More houses keep getting built and more land approved for housing development.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: davepars  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 10:16

I live up near the Odeon cinema and have kids in P2 and P5 and they are already telling us our children may have to go to Inverkeithing High!

The council / Scot Gmt have sat on this for too long and it is bitten them on the backside.

Now I don't profess to know how to run a council, but I do know some simple maths:

Planning Permission Granted + Planning Permission Granted + Planning Permission Granted + Planning Permission Granted + Planning Permission Granted + Planning Permission Granted = We're gonna need more schools



Post Edited (Mon 26 Aug 10:21)
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: Playup_Pompey  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 10:38

portacabins in the playing fields and an agreement to share playing fields with St Columbus would be a potential solution depending on how likely the building is to collapse. Access would be main difficulty given all roads in are on the opposite side of the building

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: jake89  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 10:57

DavePars, and yet 1000+ homes signed off between Kingseat and Halbeath, 1000+ being built next to QAHS right now and 2000 planned behind DHS.

That's 4000 homes so potentially hundreds more students. Pack them into Inverkeithing High, which is filled with Asbestos and crumbling away.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: evo!  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 10:58

Confirmed now i see 14 year old defo charged. In court tomorrow according to some news sites.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: JTH123  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 11:07

Quote:

jake89, Mon 26 Aug 09:50

The main concern is how a small bin fire spread so quickly. Whoever did it has potentially just ruined their life by acting an idiot.


Honestly, they deserve much more than will be coming their way. We all know that they will get off lightly.
Meanwhile my sons who are in s3 and s4 have a challenge on their hands to complete their education and the state is left to find millions to put in contingency plans.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: PARrot  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 11:17

How do you suggest punishing a 14 year old for setting fire to a bin. I dont think he realised it could possibly have spread and gutted the school.

He should be punished of course but lets keep a grip on reality.
If he deliberately set fire to the school....different matter.

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: jake89  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 11:20

I think the lads life will be bad enough. Permanently tarred as the daftie who burned down the school.

The school needed replaced anyway but this is going to cause considerable disruption for students and their families as well as the staff.

Hopefully a wake up call to the council and government to never again let schools get this close to capacity. The Scottish Government is actively encouraging development in West Fife to relieve pressure on Edinburgh but they need to ensure the plans are sustainable.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: twin par  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 11:24

Apparently, the jannies could be in bother here.Failed to put rubbish bin in cage provided to stop this happening. No excuse though.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: wee eck  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 11:37

I'm genuinely confused. How would having another modern school available in the are have stopped somebody starting a fire?
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: jake89  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 11:42

Because the modern school would be built to modern fire regulations. The new campus is also planned to be up by the cinema so out the way a bit from troublemakers.

You'd also hope the new school will have CCTV to pick up idiots in the grounds when they shouldn't be.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: Playup_Pompey  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 11:48

"I think the lads life will be bad enough. Permanently tarred as the daftie who burned down the school."

Dont see those responsible for Kings Road being flogged at the glen gates at noon every saturday.

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: dave67  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 11:50

Romour is they posted about starting the fire on Facebook

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: Playup_Pompey  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 11:52

don't think courts deal with romours/rumours mainly just facts and that is where they will deal with a suitable punishment.

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: jake89  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 11:53

Could be an interesting police campaign: Arsonists - where are they now?

I'd expect the majority won't have gotten far in life.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: General Zod  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 11:55

I used to hang about with the boy who burnt kings road. Crazy story on why he did it. He was always a bit unpredictable.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: jake89  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 11:56

Quote:

dave67, Mon 26 Aug 11:50

Romour is they posted about starting the fire on Facebook


Last week there was a bike gang going along a road somewhere (think London). One of them cycled into the side of a Merc and got his tyre stuck. The gang then surround the driver and smack his car (think they bent the Merc badge). The idiots then put it online like they were the victims! It was all headcam footage so clearly showed the cyclist go into the side of the car.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: Captain Desmond Fancey  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 12:08

"Romour is they posted about starting the fire on Facebook
"

I don't use Facebook personally, but sometimes Twitter and said boast is there for all to see.

Wasn't a bin either. He clearly knew exactly what he was doing. Still he's "only" 14 so best go easy on him, I guess.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: PARrot  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 12:27

Quote:

Captain Desmond Fancey, Mon 26 Aug 12:08

"Romour is they posted about starting the fire on Facebook
"

I don't use Facebook personally, but sometimes Twitter and said boast is there for all to see.

Wasn't a bin either. He clearly knew exactly what he was doing. Still he's "only" 14 so best go easy on him, I guess.


Is there a link to that?

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: back oh the net  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 12:28

A lengthy stay in polmont is what I would give the wee @&£? And if mummy and daddy think that’s a tad harsh on their little soldier then tough act like a f@nny you get treated like one

Come on ye pars ⚽️
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: Captain Desmond Fancey  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 13:01

Sorry Parrot, I can just about tweet but don't know how the whole link thing works on Twitter.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: Turps  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 13:05

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: moviescot  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 13:10

A nice new school will be the result. It took Aberdeen two years to build the largest academy school in the area after it was all agreed. It's a lovely school and my child just went there this year and 4 days in loves it.

The property is presumably insured although there will be a large excess in place. That will save the council and government a bit of money.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: jake89  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 13:11

If that's real then that boy is in a whole lot of trouble. If nothing else he needs extra English tuition. No idea what it is he chucked in the school. I'd be worried if I was one of his pals as he also says "we".
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: jake89  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 13:12

Quote:

moviescot, Mon 26 Aug 13:10

A nice new school will be the result. It took Aberdeen two years to build the largest academy school in the area after it was all agreed. It's a lovely school and my child just went there this year and 4 days in loves it.

The property is presumably insured although there will be a large excess in place. That will save the council and government a bit of money.


Believe the consultation for the replacement is this week. Media suggesting Woodmill kids may have to be educated out with Fife!
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: The Toun Clock  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 13:27

Not sure how true this is, but I heard there were two 14 year old boys involved and that one of their fathers found out it was them and handed them in himself.

You'd be mortified.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: JTH123  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 13:43

Quote:

moviescot, Mon 26 Aug 13:10

A nice new school will be the result. It took Aberdeen two years to build the largest academy school in the area after it was all agreed. It's a lovely school and my child just went there this year and 4 days in loves it.

The property is presumably insured although there will be a large excess in place. That will save the council and government a bit of money.


Glad it all worked out swimmingly for you. Some of our kids are not so lucky.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: moviescot  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 14:27

Quote:

JTH123, Mon 26 Aug 13:43

Quote:

moviescot, Mon 26 Aug 13:10

A nice new school will be the result. It took Aberdeen two years to build the largest academy school in the area after it was all agreed. It's a lovely school and my child just went there this year and 4 days in loves it.

The property is presumably insured although there will be a large excess in place. That will save the council and government a bit of money.


Glad it all worked out swimmingly for you. Some of our kids are not so lucky.


That really was not the point of my post. It was just to say that you will hopefully get a state of the art school deserving of the area. And it can be done quickly if the will is there to sort it out.

Hopefully the kids affected will be given proper support and be able to placed in schools.

Post Edited (Mon 26 Aug 14:28)
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: JTH123  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 16:49

Fair enough moviescot but that's how it came across.
I have professional experience of a situation like this in Sussex. It was 2 years from the fire until the new school opened and the kids were in cabins asap after the fire. The school was half the size of woodmill btw. Like everything there will be winners and losers.

Post Edited (Mon 26 Aug 16:51)
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: moviescot  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 17:33

Quote:

JTH123, Mon 26 Aug 16:49

Fair enough moviescot but that's how it came across.
I have professional experience of a situation like this in Sussex. It was 2 years from the fire until the new school opened and the kids were in cabins asap after the fire. The school was half the size of woodmill btw. Like everything there will be winners and losers.


Let's hope it will all be done within the next 2 years. School in Aberdeen was built in 2 years. 2000 capacity with large swimming pool, sports field, three gyms, dance studio and technology rooms. All state of the art. Had a first year of teething problems as they were bringing together 3 schools into one. All looks great now.

Out with school hours the public get to use the facilities.

I know it will be a long haul but hopefully you'll end up with a much better facility.

Post Edited (Mon 26 Aug 17:34)
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: jake89  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 17:37

The complication with Woodmill is that the proposal is for a combined campus with St C's and Fife College. Accelerating it's delivery may not be possible.

Hopefully the Scottish Government can assist with bringing forward funding but they don't have a great track record!

Basically, this utter idiot has screwed the students, the staff, the Fife taxpayer and the Council with this act of stupidity.

Out of interest, what happened to the kid who did Kings Road?
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: PARrot  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 18:20

From the tweet it is pretty obvious the "Kid" is under educated to say the least.

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: jake89  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 18:33

At least he tried to discretely boast by doing it on Snapchat. Shame he didn't realise you can screenshot the message though.

Can you imagine him in jail?

"How did they nab you for it?"
"Telt aw ma pals on soshul meeju that ah dun it, eh?"
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: halbe  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 18:46

Just seems to be a lot of misinformation about. Doesn't look like the 14 year old who has been charged was part of the snapchat posted above..

Woodmill das unit has a great reputation with the kids and parents and for this facility to be destroyed is devastating.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: moviescot  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 19:56

Quote:

jake89, Mon 26 Aug 17:37

The complication with Woodmill is that the proposal is for a combined campus with St C's and Fife College. Accelerating it's delivery may not be possible.

Hopefully the Scottish Government can assist with bringing forward funding but they don't have a great track record!

Basically, this utter idiot has screwed the students, the staff, the Fife taxpayer and the Council with this act of stupidity.

Out of interest, what happened to the kid who did Kings Road?


There should be money readily available from the insurance company. It'll just need topped up. This will probably save the council and government a lot of money.

Post Edited (Mon 26 Aug 19:56)
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: jake89  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 20:02

No idea on big projects but I'd imagine a chunk of cash will be spent accommodating the students for the next 2-3 years. Parents were already being told their kids may have to go to Inverkeithing. I suspect the "may" is now "will" and that's if they're lucky. Some may end up further afield!

The big saving of the project was sharing space with Fife College so no idea what happens if FC aren't ready to start building.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: rikaka  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 20:26

It's a horrible situation, but I really don't think the council are to blame. No region would be able to handle the closure of a high school.

I'd be very surprised if all the kids can be moved within west fife, the whole of Fife for that matter, Clackmannanshire may be able to assist.

The victims are the kids but the council are not at fault here, the blame lies with the kids/kid who set the fire. Regardless of what they thought might happen they will ultimately spending the foreseeable future at polmont
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: wee eck  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 20:46

In Edinburgh there's at least one unoccupied school that is used to accommodate pupils while their schools are being extensively refurbished.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: renegade master  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 21:01

My biggest concern was how quickly the roof cladding caught alight on the new section, this will be insulated panels sames as on Grenfel. These were obviously not the approved flame retardant as we were told has been fitted to all new builds in Scotland since 2012.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: DulochConvert  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 21:19

When is Queensferrys new HS suppose to be completed? Could Fife borrow it for a couple of years?
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: JTH123  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 21:19

Totally agree Rikaka. If the council had 1400 spare school places available at the drop of a hat they'd get criticised for wasting money.
I've visited disaster recovery facilities for a big investment bank and the cost of these places lying completely empty and fully kitted out with IT etc is huge but in their case the cost of not having a plan b is much bigger.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: JTH123  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 21:21

Quote:

DulochConvert, Mon 26 Aug 21:19

When is Queensferrys new HS suppose to be completed? Could Fife borrow it for a couple of years?


Think it's Easter.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: Jjonjord  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 21:32

Quote:

jake89, Mon 26 Aug 17:37

Out of interest, what happened to the kid who did Kings Road?



He got jailed for 9 months I believe. He was 16 at the time though, which does make a slight difference in how the punishment is handed out.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: purekozma  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 21:37

for anybody wanting to watch the live stream from last night it was on youtube
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bp2Eaw1Md38

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: donj  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 22:07

If they all have long travel on a bus to and from school I'd bet the idiots who did it might prefer being jailed.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: jake89  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 22:27

Quote:

wee eck, Mon 26 Aug 20:46

In Edinburgh there's at least one unoccupied school that is used to accommodate pupils while their schools are being extensively refurbished.


A spare high school? Are you sure? Edinburgh Council is £2bn in debt so I can't imagine them holding onto a spare high school given they're about to lease out part of the City Chambers to a holiday let outfit and already leased out the Lothian Chambers to the French consulate.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: NikNakPar  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 22:29

Not sure what kind of punishment he will receive but for those saying polmont that won’t happen as he is too young. Youngest you can be sent to polmont is 16. Not sure if he can be put to some sort of detention centre or not. I can’t see any form of time away for him as said above the 16 year old who was responsible for kings road got 6 months but being 2 years older was always going to get a custodial sentence due to age.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: wee eck  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 22:58

''Topic Originator: jake89 like | nolike
Date: Mon 26 Aug 22:27Quote:

wee eck, Mon 26 Aug 20:46

In Edinburgh there's at least one unoccupied school that is used to accommodate pupils while their schools are being extensively refurbished.


A spare high school? Are you sure? Edinburgh Council is £2bn in debt so I can't imagine them holding onto a spare high school given they're about to lease out part of the City Chambers to a holiday let outfit and already leased out the Lothian Chambers to the French consulate.''

It's called Darroch School and is about 10 minutes walk from Tollcross. I think at one time it was an annexe of St Thomas of Aquins School. A few years ago it was used to accommodate some of the pupils of James Gillespie HS whilst it was being refurbished. It's an old building but it may also be used for other purposes.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: KirklistonPar  
Date:   Mon 26 Aug 23:13

The new high school in queensferry is due to be at full capacity in the next couple of years. So I wouldn’t of thought there would be enough room.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: DBP  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 08:15

Quote:

wee eck, Mon 26 Aug 20:46

In Edinburgh there's at least one unoccupied school that is used to accommodate pupils while their schools are being extensively refurbished.


Don't believe that's a steady state operating model, merely decant space while they go through a series of planned refurbishments. When refurbishment programme is completed, don't believe that's being kept as a warm site
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: jake89  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 08:20

Wee eck, Darroch is planned to or is already being used by Gillespie's and Boroughmuir. When they moved Boroughmuir they built it to hold the current number of students and seemed to forget that all the properties being built in the area (including conversion of the old school!) might add to the school role. No doubt comes down to ScotGov funding but the new Boroughmuir is a joke. Playing fields on the roof and the discovered asbestos all through the grass area they share with Napier next door.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: GG Riva  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 08:28

I understand that a part of the school has not been damaged by the fire, but will almost certainly be smoke damaged, as was the case when the head's office and school office was torched in St Columba's in the mid-70s. If that part is deemed still usable then some temporary accommodation in the playing fields of both Woodmill and St Columba's may be the best solution until such times as a new school can be built.



Not your average Sunday League player.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: renegade master  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 08:40

GG the problem with the old part of the school I believe is the asbestos content making any refurbishment or repairs to the correct the smoke damage difficult.

This will include any repairs and investigation works to the services like electrics, plumbing and gas lines.

If Fife council do have plans drawn for a new school somewhere then this would a godsend and save a drastic amount of time, as the ideal solution would be to build new on the playing fields while painstakingly demolishing the existing building while sharing the playing fields at St Columbus.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: doctordandruff  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 08:52

If 1/3 of the main building is beyond repair that still leaves a lot of rooms after clean up and equipment replaced. There also gyms and a games hall that can be converted to classes and sharing big facilities with St Columbas. Hopefully anything that disperses the pupils wont be for too long.

My concern is they put money before the kids, refuse to invest in a school that was to be replaced and are left with an appalling high school experience
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: GG Riva  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 09:15

Quote:

renegade master, Tue 27 Aug 08:40

GG the problem with the old part of the school I believe is the asbestos content making any refurbishment or repairs to the correct the smoke damage difficult.

This will include any repairs and investigation works to the services like electrics, plumbing and gas lines.

If Fife council do have plans drawn for a new school somewhere then this would a godsend and save a drastic amount of time, as the ideal solution would be to build new on the playing fields while painstakingly demolishing the existing building while sharing the playing fields at St Columbus.


I've no idea about the asbestos content at Woodmill, but I do know the kids at St Columba's only missed the last 2 weeks of the session after the fire in June. Teachers were asked to go in and given wellies to help with the cleaning up. ☹

The place was still very smelly when we reopened after the summer holidays. The asbestos in the school was finally removed during a summer in the 90s, IIRC.



Not your average Sunday League player.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: DulochConvert  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 11:26

It’s a lot more than 1/3 of the building that’s been destroyed, I work beside a retained firefighter who was there for 8hrs and the footage shot inside the building is horrendous. Even the areas that were not badly effected by the fire are under 1ft of water, with water pouring in from the floor above.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: jake89  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 13:18

The funding for the new school(s) was seemingly ringfenced so there should be no issue from the council side. The issue will be getting the remaining funding from Scottish Government. That and agreeing with Fife College how to plan the site. Not sure what it is they're planning tp share resource wise. May just be gym halls but could be computer and science labs too.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: PARrot  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 16:17

The snapchat post wasnt the lad who did it. That was a hoax. The guy who did it is devastated as are his parents. If you read her facebook thread you can see they are suffering a fare bit before any punishment is handed out.



Post Edited (Tue 27 Aug 21:53)
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: Playup_Pompey  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 16:24

school closed "short to medium term" with this afternoons statement.

Punishment for the little boy started well where was still able to post on social media to his family whilst detained pending court appearance.

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: moviescot  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 16:35

Quote:

jake89, Tue 27 Aug 13:18

The funding for the new school(s) was seemingly ringfenced so there should be no issue from the council side. The issue will be getting the remaining funding from Scottish Government. That and agreeing with Fife College how to plan the site. Not sure what it is they're planning tp share resource wise. May just be gym halls but could be computer and science labs too.


They won't need all the ring fenced costs now. Or they could get the insurance payout and use the ring fenced money to create a super, future proofed school.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: Captain Desmond Fancey  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 17:05

Might have known the sympathy would start on this forum as well.

It's all over social media too. No wonder respect for the law is seemingly ay an all time low these days.

Maybe instead of directing sympathy at an arsonist people should watch the clip of one of the devastated pupils from DAS then they'd really see who is "suffering enough"
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: dave67  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 17:05

teenager, who can't be named for legal reasons, appeared at Dunfermline Sheriff Court on Tuesday accused of wilful fireraising to danger of life.

The boy, from Kirkcaldy, was released on bail pending further inquiries.

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: GG Riva  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 17:22

Quote:

PARrot, Tue 27 Aug 16:17

The snapchat post wasnt the lad who did it. That was a hoax. The guy who did it is devastated as are his parents. If you read her facebook thread you can see they are suffering a fare bit before any punishment is handed out. Search Name removed by Admin Please dont troll she is suffering enough.


I don't know about that but a friend of the lad's mum read me a Snapchat post in which the boy said he was very sorry for ruining the lives and education of so many people. He said that it was a carry on gone wrong and that his sister was not involved. He alone was responsible for the fire. He thought he'd probably get time but hoped he might be sent back to live with his parents. It also appears that his dad is in trouble for giving the lad a doing.



Not your average Sunday League player.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: General Zod  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 17:29

What a bunch of gossiping old women. It seems there is a lot of wrong information out there. This is the worst thing about social media. Everyone desperately trying to appear relevant. It’s embarrassing.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: Mr Mac  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 17:34

Lots of mention of Insurance paying for the replacement school.... Can anyone state for certain there is Buildings Insurance in place?

When we got married at the Glen Pavilion we were told you couldn't have candles on tables as the council 'self insures' the building as premiums are too high.....

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: PARrot  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 17:37

Quote:

Captain Desmond Fancey, Tue 27 Aug 17:05

Might have known the sympathy would start on this forum as well.

It's all over social media too. No wonder respect for the law is seemingly ay an all time low these days.

Maybe instead of directing sympathy at an arsonist people should watch the clip of one of the devastated pupils from DAS then they'd really see who is "suffering enough"


What a load of utter BS. Apart from the devasted pupils part.
He and his family are being punished and he will be punished adequately. No need to demonise him.

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: dave67  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 17:41

'' Lots of mention of Insurance paying for the replacement school.... Can anyone state for certain there is Buildings Insurance in place? ''

Kings Road was built with insurance money

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: PARrot  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 17:49

Just as a matter of interest, what in general opinion is suitable punishment. Baring in mind the scope of the crime is from willful fire raising to the endangerment of life (although possibly too young to have fully appreciated the potential consequences) to wreckless misdemeanor.
No doubt his previous behaviour will be taken into account too.
CDF probably wants him shot at dawn but any realists here with thoughts?

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: BigJPar  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 17:56

Quote:

PARrot, Tue 27 Aug 17:49

Just as a matter of interest, what in general opinion is suitable punishment. Baring in mind the scope of the crime is from willful fire raising to the endangerment of life (although possibly too young to have fully appreciated the potential consequences) to wreckless misdemeanor.
No doubt his previous behaviour will be taken into account too.
CDF probably wants him shot at dawn but any realists here with thoughts?


For me a period in a secure children's unit. That's if it's an option.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: dave67  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 17:56

Give him a job with council planning dept. He's worked out how to get a new high school quicker than faye and her cronies 😂 😂
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: Mr Mac  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 18:01

Quote:

dave67, Tue 27 Aug 17:41

'' Lots of mention of Insurance paying for the replacement school.... Can anyone state for certain there is Buildings Insurance in place? ''

Kings Road was built with insurance money


Glad to hear that....

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: dafc  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 18:29

The Snapchat message not a hoax. More than one involved,other charges to follow. 3-4 years sentence minimal - a couple in a secure children’s unit, then young offenders for a couple minimum. Whatever sentence it won’t be long enough. Going to cost millions, loads of kids work lost, and the most vulnerable kids being forced hit hardest too.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: Captain Desmond Fancey  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 18:47

"No need to demonise him."

Putting on my Jack Jarvis voice here, but that's birthday caird p*sh.

Two firemen in hospital, 1400 kids displaced, millions plus repair bill, to say nothing of the businesses that will suffer around lunchtime and school closing time.

Still he's just a bairn and all that so we should go easy on him.

The mother's posts, at least the ones I've seen now, are nothing more than rubbing salt in wounds. Abusing people who were being perfectly polite in their criticism of events.

As for your shot at dawn comment.. Seriously, grow up.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: sammer  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 19:00

Regarding punishment, six months spent in wellies undertaking general labouring duties to prepare a new site will teach the offender a great deal more about rehabilitation than he is likely to learn in penal institution. It might be the making of him.

I would be wary of phrases like ‘state-of the-art’ new schools since I can remember walking round Woodmill School when it was opened to the public prior to its official opening in 1960 when it was being hailed as a great architectural wonder by local dignitaries. Now I discover from this site it was planned for replacement. I remember Inverkeithing HS was also a wonder of the age when it opened in 1973, its design ingeniously imitating the outline of a tractor no less, but is now considered ready for the scrap yard.

Maybe we should find some Edwardians who know how to build schools that last. Interesting that Darroch School in Fountainbridge still seems to be standing despite being opened in 1907 and having had to contend with a lively Sean Connery as one of its pupils. McLean School, built in the North of Dunfermline around the same time, seems to be in good enough nick. I am very sceptical that ‘new build’ is cheaper than restoration: I never see Fettes Academy or Heriot’s Academy going down that road. If you build properly with stone it costs more on outlay but probably works out cheaper in the long run.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: PARrot  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 19:04

Whilst I agree with you that the law is often too soft and adequate punishment is required, I think we need to know more about the incident before we judge so harshly. The outcome was horrific but you have to take intent into consideration. Was the snap chat a hoax? No doubt we will find out.
Im willing to bet if your best mates son ... or your own did the same thing, your opinion would be much softer.
Strangers are always bigger villains.

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: sammer  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 19:05

'Putting on my Jack Jarvis voice here, but that's birthday caird p*sh.
Two firemen in hospital, 1400 kids displaced, millions plus repair bill, to say nothing of the businesses that will suffer around lunchtime and school closing time.'


Punishment linked to damage caused is an interesting concept. Not one accepted by neo-liberals however, which I assumed CDF might have been. The proud boast of our political class, following the financial crash which destroyed our grandchildren's future, remains, 'Not one banker jailed!'

sammer

Post Edited (Tue 27 Aug 19:08)
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: JTH123  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 19:14

I'd go a step further Sammer. A month or 2 shovelling the burnt crap that used to be the school into skips then the same again cleaning the toilets of the local police and fire stations.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: back oh the net  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 19:15

The snapchat post wasnt the lad who did it. That was a hoax. The guy who did it is devastated as are his parents. If you read her facebook thread you can see they are suffering a fare bit before any punishment is handed out. Search Please dont troll she is suffering enough.

aye mibby so but reading her latest post gives the impression that its no big deal because "no one died"

as for your last post about him probably not being old enough to appreciate fully the consequences of his actions that is complete rubbish he knew exactly what he was doing so there for he knew exactly how much trouble he would be in when caught i am with dafc and cdf here get the wee fud banged up for a few years in youth detention then polmont mibby that will open his eyes PS.....your not related to the boy in question are you PARrot? doing your absolute best to stick up for him

and GG if his dad gave him a hiding when he found out then good hopefully a few more coming along the road

Come on ye pars ⚽️
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: PARrot  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 19:20

Quote:

sammer, Tue 27 Aug 19:05

'Putting on my Jack Jarvis voice here, but that's birthday caird p*sh.
Two firemen in hospital, 1400 kids displaced, millions plus repair bill, to say nothing of the businesses that will suffer around lunchtime and school closing time.'


Punishment linked to damage caused is an interesting concept. Not one accepted by neo-liberals however, which I assumed CDF might have been. The proud boast of our political class, following the financial crash which destroyed our grandchildren's future, remains, 'Not one banker jailed!'


Touche!

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: alwaysaPar  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 19:28

Quote:

PARrot, Tue 27 Aug 17:49

Just as a matter of interest, what in general opinion is suitable punishment. Baring in mind the scope of the crime is from willful fire raising to the endangerment of life (although possibly too young to have fully appreciated the potential consequences) to wreckless misdemeanor.
No doubt his previous behaviour will be taken into account too.
CDF probably wants him shot at dawn but any realists here with thoughts?




Quote:

PARrot, Tue 27 Aug 19:04

Whilst I agree with you that the law is often too soft and adequate punishment is required, I think we need to know more about the incident before we judge so harshly. The outcome was horrific but you have to take intent into consideration. Was the snap chat a hoax? No doubt we will find out.
Im willing to bet if your best mates son ... or your own did the same thing, your opinion would be much softer.
Strangers are always bigger villains.


You want peoples opinion on what they think is suitable punishment then say we need to know more before we judge ???

Make your mind up min !!!!
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: LochgellyAlbert  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 19:32

Quote:

Mr Mac, Tue 27 Aug 17:34

Lots of mention of Insurance paying for the replacement school.... Can anyone state for certain there is Buildings Insurance in place?
...


Was at a few school fires when I worked down in Kirkcaldy and was informed that the schools were not insured due to high premiums.

I have since heard that there is insurance with conditions:- any new school must be built on the same site as the existing school.

Also as an ex Woodmill pupil I am very sad about this incident, and hope it can recover!
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: PARrot  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 19:35

Quote:

back oh the net, Tue 27 Aug 19:15

The snapchat post wasnt the lad who did it. That was a hoax. The guy who did it is devastated as are his parents. If you read her facebook thread you can see they are suffering a fare bit before any punishment is handed out. Search Denise Findlay. Please dont troll she is suffering enough.

aye mibby so but reading her latest post gives the impression that its no big deal because "no one died"

as for your last post about him probably not being old enough to appreciate fully the consequences of his actions that is complete rubbish he knew exactly what he was doing so there for he knew exactly how much trouble he would be in when caught i am with dafc and cdf here get the wee fud banged up for a few years in youth detention then polmont mibby that will open his eyes PS.....your not related to the boy in question are you PARrot? doing your absolute best to stick up for him

and GG if his dad gave him a hiding when he found out then good hopefully a few more coming along the road


A lot of high emotions affecting sound analysis meyhinks.
Im not defending the individual at all.
Im defending the principal the punishment fits the crime....but what is the crime. Was it a silly prank that went horrendously wrong or a willful act to ruin peoples lives, injure (or worse) firemen and screw up local businesses.
Just be honest. Which was it, because a fitting punishment will be determined by these facts rather than the lynch mob.

Yes I am related. I believe we are all Jock Tamson's bairns.

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: doctordandruff  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 19:46

Silly prank? Silly prank is chucking a well chewed piece of A4 at the blackboard. Going armed with oil to ensure a teaching facility for disabled kids burns is not a silly prank.

It's almost feeling to me that the more damage he caused the more we should feel sorry for him. I do feel for the parents as I dont think I could look my son in the face ever again if he did that. I certainly wouldn't be posting 'Hey nobody died' BS.

Post Edited (Tue 27 Aug 19:47)
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: jake89  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 19:49

I thought the story was that he set fire to a bin. I also assumed it was a local lad. Suddenly he's from Kirkcaldy and took oil with him? That sounds more like arson!
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: PARrot  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 19:55

Thats the whole point. I dont think anyone knows what actually happened.
My understanding was he lit a bin. Hence my opinion.
Others stem from the asumtion the snapchat was genuine and have stronger feelings. Maybe we should pause til we know.

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: jake89  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 19:58

The lad is definitely from Kirkcaldy according to the report meaning it wasn't like he was just hanging around where he lives and thought it'd be a laugh.

Sympathy with the family but not so much the wee lad. He's disrupted so many local families, put 2 fire fighters in hospital and cost the taxpayer ££££ whilst he'll be able to go back to his school in Kirkcaldy next week like nothing's happened.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: doctordandruff  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 20:02

My assumption comes from what I was told a couple of hours after it started. It also included the boy's name and where he came from (as well as personal stuff). They've all been correct so far.

Post Edited (Tue 27 Aug 20:04)
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: EEP  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 20:12

Reading some posts on here and Facebook the boy should be hanged in front off the glen gates then escorted through Fife.
Did he mean to cause that fire that ripped through the school..... I doubt it but he has to learn what he caused and the thousands of people effected.
Locking him up in a cell with other prisoners he will probably learn a lot more on how to break the law.
I think we should wait till after the court hearing then see what happens.
The only thing that should be done is he’s tagged to stay in his house/back garden and not allowed to leave till the hearing/sentence.
Mind you if that was me I would be in hiding.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: EEP  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 20:16

And before all .net bedwetters go off one one he does/did attend Woodmill.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: BigJPar  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 20:18

Quote:

PARrot, Tue 27 Aug 19:35

Quote:

back oh the net, Tue 27 Aug 19:15

The snapchat post wasnt the lad who did it. That was a hoax. The guy who did it is devastated as are his parents. If you read her facebook thread you can see they are suffering a fare bit before any punishment is handed out. Search Denise Findlay. Please dont troll she is suffering enough.

aye mibby so but reading her latest post gives the impression that its no big deal because "no one died"

as for your last post about him probably not being old enough to appreciate fully the consequences of his actions that is complete rubbish he knew exactly what he was doing so there for he knew exactly how much trouble he would be in when caught i am with dafc and cdf here get the wee fud banged up for a few years in youth detention then polmont mibby that will open his eyes PS.....your not related to the boy in question are you PARrot? doing your absolute best to stick up for him

and GG if his dad gave him a hiding when he found out then good hopefully a few more coming along the road


A lot of high emotions affecting sound analysis meyhinks.
Im not defending the individual at all.
Im defending the principal the punishment fits the crime....but what is the crime. Was it a silly prank that went horrendously wrong or a willful act to ruin peoples lives, injure (or worse) firemen and screw up local businesses.
Just be honest. Which was it, because a fitting punishment will be determined by these facts rather than the lynch mob.

Yes I am related. I believe we are all Jock Tamson's bairns.


From what I'm led to believe parrot, the blowing up of a gas cannister was involved. At 14 I'm sure he was fully aware what the consequences of his actions could be. Little scroat needs taught a lesson.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: jake89  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 20:19

Seems to be a lot of misinformation going around if he is/was a Woodmill pupil as media have said he's from Kirkcaldy.

It'll all come out in the wash.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: doctordandruff  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 20:23

Theres personal reasons connecting them. I cant really type what I'd like, but he was pretty chuffed with his work while the DAS unit was being destroyed.

Post Edited (Tue 27 Aug 20:24)
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: PARrot  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 20:31

So much info and all conflicting. Im out until I know the truth.

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: back oh the net  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 20:36

Mind shut the door

Come on ye pars ⚽️
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: moviescot  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 20:43

Just for some clarity on insurance. Most councils are insured via Zurich Re. They tend to insure for catastrophe perils such as fire, storm and flood. Other normal perils do not normal cause major damage so will tend to be self insured by councils

There is often a large excess that the council will carry to reduce the premiums. This will tend to be from £100,000 upwards. Small beer in terms of the damage here.

I would be very surprised if Fife council do not have insurance for catastrophe perils. From memory I think the government used to insist on these perils.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: BigJPar  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 20:48

The facts here are ferol kids burnt down a school causing millions of pounds in damages. They need the full force of the law brought down on them. They weren't to know the school was even empty!
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: red-star-par  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 20:50

No sympathy from me for this kid. He is old enough to know right from wrong. He should feel the full force of the law
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: widtink  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 20:52

Exactly PARrot
Social media is not exactly known for being the best place for the truth... Far from it in fact.
The truth will come out in due course... Then we can all give our thoughts. At the moment we're all just guessing and jumping to conclusions.
May I also remind everyone that at the moment this is an ongoing case and the alleged culprit cannot be named for legal reasons.
So please... If you do know this lads identity... Do not post it on here.
This site has to protect itself.
Ta
Widders



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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: BigJPar  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 20:59

Quote:

widtink, Tue 27 Aug 20:52

Exactly PARrot
Social media is not exactly known for being the best place for the truth... Far from it in fact.
The truth will come out in due course... Then we can all give our thoughts. At the moment we're all just guessing and jumping to conclusions.
May I also remind everyone that at the moment this is an ongoing case and the alleged culprit cannot be named for legal reasons.
So please... If you do know this lads identity... Do not post it on here.
This site has to protect itself.
Ta
Widders


Dunfermline is a small town. Lots of people already know what went on, and it's nothing to do with social media.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: doctordandruff  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 21:02

Exactly. There are opinions on this thread based on facts. Dont assume it's all just hearsay and social media fake news.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: back oh the net  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 21:12

aye but remember he's just a bairn and he made a bad choice and aw that P!sh as for his mum and other family members defending him on the press page imo thats just trolling for sympathy and probably would have been better not saying anything but then again its to be expected when you read some of their comments

if it was me doing something like that at his age my mum and dad and probably the rest of my family would have disowned me

but still he's only 14 and doesn't know right from wrong eh?

Come on ye pars ⚽️
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: P  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 21:22

Absolutely punish him as far as the law will allow and demonise him and maybe the next brain dead chimp will think twice before similar abhorrent behaviour.

The whole softly softly cuddle care is clearly not working which is why there are so many horrible little scroats that know they are bullet proof and can get away with doing whatever they want because some mug will be along to make excuses for them. The wretched little scumbag knew his intent and deserves zero sympathy
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: QPR_Par  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 21:22

It's a bit late advising posters not to reveal the boy's name. PARrot has already posted his mother's name so it doesn't take a rocket scientist to identify him.

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: widtink  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 21:26

OK I tried to say it nicely but fair enough...
If anyone names him on this site they will be ejected and the thread also.
That's the way it is unfortunately.
This is an ongoing case and he cannot be named at this time by law.
Again, this site has to protect itself.
Ta
Widders



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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: Andrew283  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 21:36

Genuinely surprised names have been getting posted on here and said posts have not been deleted by admin.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: PARrot  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 21:45

Quote:

back oh the net, Tue 27 Aug 20:36

Mind shut the door


Ok Larry.

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: jake89  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 21:47

The problem with social media is that people aren't trained in how to use it. Some of the stuff the family has posted is well meaning but is fanning the flames. They need to leave it to the court.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: PARrot  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 21:48

Quote:

Andrew283, Tue 27 Aug 21:36

Genuinely surprised names have been getting posted on here and said posts have not been deleted by admin.


I posted her name because her fb post was public. It looked like she wanted her side of the story to be told. She wanted to correct misinformation.

Ill delete it if it could be a problem.

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: PARrot  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 21:50

My bad but the mother went public on fb to correct mis information so I figured it was ok.

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: Parsbilly  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 21:55

Gutted that parrot has left this shambles of a thread.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: EEP  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 21:55

Ha ha .net at its finest!😅😅
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: widtink  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 21:57

No you done nothing wrong PARrot.
But thank you... as there is obviously a bit of a link.
We're only concerned that nobody posts this young laddies name.
Purely in the best interests of this site.
Ta
Widders



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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: PARrot  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 21:57

Quote:

back oh the net, Tue 27 Aug 21:12

aye but remember he's just a bairn and he made a bad choice and aw that P!sh as for his mum and other family members defending him on the press page imo thats just trolling for sympathy and probably would have been better not saying anything but then again its to be expected when you read some of their comments

if it was me doing something like that at his age my mum and dad and probably the rest of my family would have disowned me

but still he's only 14 and doesn't know right from wrong eh?


Maybe thats why you are so judgemental 😉
His parents apparently leathered him (hearsay) and called the police. He is still their son. I think they did enough. Now he should be adequately punished but still needs his parents support.

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: PARrot  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 22:01

Quote:

Parsbilly, Tue 27 Aug 21:55

Gutted that parrot has left this shambles of a thread.


Lol. Im out second guessing what happened but still in the chat.
Incidentally. How would you all feel if the pressure of all the hate got too much for him and he topped himself. Would you still hate him?

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: BigJPar  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 22:05

Quote:

PARrot, Tue 27 Aug 21:57

Quote:

back oh the net, Tue 27 Aug 21:12

aye but remember he's just a bairn and he made a bad choice and aw that P!sh as for his mum and other family members defending him on the press page imo thats just trolling for sympathy and probably would have been better not saying anything but then again its to be expected when you read some of their comments

if it was me doing something like that at his age my mum and dad and probably the rest of my family would have disowned me

but still he's only 14 and doesn't know right from wrong eh?


Maybe thats why you are so judgemental 😉
His parents apparently leathered him (hearsay) and called the police. He is still their son. I think they did enough. Now he should be adequately punished but still needs his parents support.



He'll get sat down with a counsellor and they'll find out what was troubling the poor wee lamb.
He should be in a children's home with an itchy blanket just now. Well adjusted 14 year olds don't set schools on fire.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: BigJPar  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 22:09

Does anyone else think that the fact that the family are spouting off all over the Dunfermline press Facebook page speaks volumes? Utterly classless way to act. Anything they say will only make things worse.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: jake89  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 22:30

It's no more classless than some of the disgusting things people are suggesting should happen to the boy. Some of the rants from supposed adults are baffling.

The only person who knows what actually happened is the idiot that did it. That will come out during his hearing. In the meantime all we have is hearsay.

No matter the outcome, there's still 1400 kids not getting the education they deserve. Sorting things for them should be people's concern rather than how best to string up a wee boy.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: StevenPar77  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 22:33

Definitely an existing pupil of Woodmill HS.

http://www.agiftfor.net
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: BigJPar  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 22:36

Quote:

jake89, Tue 27 Aug 22:30

It's no more classless than some of the disgusting things people are suggesting should happen to the boy. Some of the rants from supposed adults are baffling.

The only person who knows what actually happened is the idiot that did it. That will come out during his hearing. In the meantime all we have is hearsay.

No matter the outcome, there's still 1400 kids not getting the education they deserve. Sorting things for them should be people's concern rather than how best to string up a wee boy.


Your 2nd paragraph is factually incorrect

Post Edited (Tue 27 Aug 22:36)
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: PARrot  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 22:39

....but his point is spot on.

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: EEP  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 22:46

😅😅.net alert... Let the truth come out...😅
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: sammer  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 22:58

Despite Parrot’s best efforts it seems the thread is developing into a competition as to who can condemn a 14 year old culprit the most. Not the most inspiring of adult responses.

I still await comment on my earlier remark regarding the cheap build mentality of schools themselves, which are no longer being built to last. An architectural award, a few photo-shoots with local dignitaries, and then they are not fit for purpose after 50 years? So how come Dunfermline Town Hall is still standing? The taxpayers are expected to be dazzled by some new-build monstrosity built by the cheapest materials at hand, and then cough up again when the thing falls apart.

In your lifetime have you seen a good looking school built in Fife? Inverkeithing, which was opened by the Queen’s less illustrious sister, from the beginning looked like that good lady after a night out on the lash. Lochgelly was a much an army barracks as a school. The Kirkcaldy HS renovation of the 1990s ripped up parquet flooring and replaced it with thick rubber. I will reserve judgment on Queen Anne and Levenmouth Academy until I see them at close quarters, but the photographs are not encouraging. The old Viewforth School was a gem from the outside but the new Windmill site seems to have gone for the ASDA look in its rebuild.

So before the good citizens of Dunfermline line up at the Glen Gates to flay the corpse of the arsonist responsible for the Woodmill fire, it might be a good idea to pass judgment on those who are responsible- contractors, local politicians, architects, local council safety officers- for the buildings where young people are educated. Hold them to the same standards of accountability if you have the courage for that. An earlier commentator did manage to make a link to the Grenfell fire which has also been ignored. The Fife taxpayer is being sold shoddy buildings in the name of progress and the media are yet to examine the links between those who award the contracts and those who benefit financially from them. No matter, they are probably calling up Barbara Dickson to see if she can do a benefit concert.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: Raymie the Legend  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 23:03

I'm told that the fire would never have spread so far in days gone by when firemen could fight the fire from within.
I do appreciate it that it's better to lose a building than a firefighter.




It's bloody tough being a legend
Ron Atkinson - 1983
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: back oh the net  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 23:10

so the people that built the school are responsible for some wee ned setting fire to it? is that what you are saying? the fact that the bit that housed the science department went up after he support unit is more than likely a major factor into how it took hold so fast but hey dont let that get in the way of the finger pointing

as has been mentioned already how was this wee fud to know the building was empty the buck stops with him im afraid no one else

Come on ye pars ⚽️
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: PARrot  
Date:   Tue 27 Aug 23:44

Quote:

back oh the net, Tue 27 Aug 23:10

so the people that built the school are responsible for some wee ned setting fire to it? is that what you are saying? the fact that the bit that housed the science department went up after he support unit is more than likely a major factor into how it took hold so fast but hey dont let that get in the way of the finger pointing

as has been mentioned already how was this wee fud to know the building was empty the buck stops with him im afraid no one else


You don't seem to be able to grasp the fact that we are not defending a little angel for deliberately torching a school and risking lives, nor are we saying he should get lightly punished.
He should be suitably punished for what he did....but what did he actually do?

Did he blow up a gas canister to destroy the school, Douse the building in oil to burn it down or mischieviously set fire to a bin which, to his horror, spread through a badly designed building, gutting it and causing all the ensuing damage to the community his otherwise socially acceptable family have to live in.
Some claim to be in the know but all these scenarios have been mooted.
My opinion on his just punishment will vary depending on the intent. Im not going to condem him for doing something stupid that got out of hand so much as if he set out to destroy the school.

Why be so quick to jump to a verdict. I don't know if he is a ned with a grudge or a scared kid who is normally ok but had a rush of blood to the head and fkd up.
Niether do most of you.



Post Edited (Wed 28 Aug 08:41)
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: Parsbilly  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 05:26

good, he's back
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: jake89  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 06:56

Sammer, the City Chambers is a bit like Trigger's broom in Only Fools and Horses. It's had an absolute fortune spent on it over the years to maintain it. It's maintained because it's a nice looking and listed building that would be difficult to knock down.

If you look back to 60s/70s Edinburgh you'll see that a load of beautiful buildings were knocked down. I can only assume listed status held little weight back then. All those beautiful buildings hadn't been maintained so the were pulled down and replaced with the fairly disgusting panel buildings. The absolute irony is that these eyesores are listed so it's hard to pull them down!
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: GG Riva  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 07:24

While I'm not advocating that the boy gets a pat on the head or a finger wigging and told not to do that again, I can't help thinking we could form a bona fide lynch mob from some elements in our fan base. "Let's string the critter up and find out what actually happened later" seems to be the chosen strategy.

He must be adequately punished in a way which reflects the seriousness of his crime, but not necessarily as a deterrent to others, since we all know - deep down - that deterrents don't really work, as most criminals think they're too smart to be caught.

If you don't believe that, ask yourselves why there isn't less crime in states which still have the death penalty.



Not your average Sunday League player.


Post Edited (Wed 28 Aug 07:25)
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: JTH123  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 08:59

Parrot, you ask "what did he actually do?".
He deliberately set fire to the school, risking lives, causing millions of pounds worth of damage and affecting the education of 1400 kids and causing a lot of stress and hassle to their families in the short term.
You may have meant to ask what did he intend? Doesn't matter now does it?
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: PARrot  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 09:29

Quote:

JTH123, Wed 28 Aug 08:59

Parrot, you ask "what did he actually do?".
He deliberately set fire to the school, risking lives, causing millions of pounds worth of damage and affecting the education of 1400 kids and causing a lot of stress and hassle to their families in the short term.
You may have meant to ask what did he intend? Doesn't matter now does it?


Yes it does matter. It matters a great deal. Sad you cant see that.
Its the difference between an irresponsible fool who is genuinely remoseful and a vindictive dangerous criminal.

Massive difference.

Once again though...did he DELIBERATELY set fire to the school?

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: PARrot  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 10:00

If you had a 14 year old son who chucked a glass of water at his brother in a squabble and the water landed on your laptop, wiping a years work and costing your company and subsiduaries lots of money - would you look at him and judge him the same way as if he got pissted off at you for stopping him doing something he wanted to do, and horsed your laptop in the bath?

Same result but.....

I still don't know which is the case here.

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: Captain Desmond Fancey  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 10:14

"So much info and all conflicting. Im out until I know the truth."

If only.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: JTH123  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 10:38

Parrot. You're making (up) excuses. I haven't heard a single piece of information that says anything other than he deliberately set fire to the school. Granted I wasn't there.

The analogy about a laptop isn't even close.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: Ben,D.A  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 10:39

Was it deliberate or an irresponsible fool.
The lad set fire to bins beside a school with no thought or concern of his actions. The fact he set a fire in the first place is wrong, to bins is worse and when up against the wall of a school is downright malicious. If he thought of any consequences of his actions he would never have set a fire in the first place. This 'Lad' will be able to vote in less than 2 years so should face the responsibility he brought on HIMSELF.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: PARrot  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 10:50

Quote:

Captain Desmond Fancey, Wed 28 Aug 10:14

"So much info and all conflicting. Im out until I know the truth."

If only.


Thankyou.

You remind me of that teacher who belted the whole class because someone with a sore tummy farted and was too shy to own up.

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: PARrot  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 10:53

Quote:

JTH123, Wed 28 Aug 10:38

Parrot. You're making (up) excuses. I haven't heard a single piece of information that says anything other than he deliberately set fire to the school. Granted I wasn't there.

The analogy about a laptop isn't even close.


I heard he set fire to a bucket. But it isnt the incident that concerns me most its the principle of recognising the difference between foolish irresponsibility and willful malicious crime. The punishment shouldnt be the same. The analogy is fine



Post Edited (Wed 28 Aug 10:55)
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: JTH123  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 11:03

As for whether what he intended matters now. Imho it matters to very very few. The consequences for the thousands - and when you factor-in the families directly affected there are thousands - are identical.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: PARrot  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 11:08

Quote:

JTH123, Wed 28 Aug 11:03

As for whether what he intended matters now. Imho it matters to very very few. The consequences for the thousands - and when you factor-in the families directly affected there are thousands - are identical.


Yep well its amazing how opinions can change when its someone close who is involved.

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: Parplod  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 11:20

Thanks to our feathered friend the family’s identity has been made known to all on here who had no link with the local/school community. He also expresses concern about what the ramifications of all the social media posts might mean for the individual’s future wellbeing (‘topping himself’ is the phrase mentioned)!!!!
As regards wilful actions, if I was to take the boy’s obligatory smartphone, designer gear and other prized possessions and torch them I’m sure he would identify that as wrong and a wilful act.
Having been directed by Parrot, posts purporting to be from the boy and his family give an insight. He doesn’t seem to have engaged with the first 8/9 years of his education. English is clearly a second language.
What a contrast to learn of the Fraserburgh teenagers who saved a drowning father and his child at the weekend. Articulate, responsible young people.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: JTH123  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 11:23

Mine certainly not changed, on the basis of the information available.

Strongly suspect yours would if you were affected though.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: Grant  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 11:37

Sammer, Queen Anne looks nice as does Beath High School, the primarys that have been built recently also look nice. Not sure what point you're trying to make.

If this **** hadn't set fire to the School then woodmill would be standing now no questions asked.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: PARrot  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 11:47

Quote:

Parplod, Wed 28 Aug 11:20

Thanks to our feathered friend the family’s identity has been made known to all on here who had no link with the local/school community. He also expresses concern about what the ramifications of all the social media posts might mean for the individual’s future wellbeing (‘topping himself’ is the phrase mentioned)!!!!
As regards wilful actions, if I was to take the boy’s obligatory smartphone, designer gear and other prized possessions and torch them I’m sure he would identify that as wrong and a wilful act.
Having been directed by Parrot, posts purporting to be from the boy and his family give an insight. He doesn’t seem to have engaged with the first 8/9 years of his education. English is clearly a second language.
What a contrast to learn of the Fraserburgh teenagers who saved a drowning father and his child at the weekend. Articulate, responsible young people.


I posted the link to the facebook page because it was public and the mother seemed keen to get her story out. If it had not been so, I wouldn't have.
It seemed fair to let her voice be heard.
Whether you agree with her or not is up to you.
There certainly are a lot of so called friends doing them no favours with their contributions.

I wonder how this same lad would have acted if he found himself in a position to save a life. Possibly the same way as the lads you mentioned. Who knows.

I dont see how his grasp of English is relevant and I dont know if he has designer gear. We arent even sure if the English you refer to is his or a spoof.

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: PARrot  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 11:52

Quote:

JTH123, Wed 28 Aug 11:23

Mine certainly not changed, on the basis of the information available.

Strongly suspect yours would if you were affected though.


No. Because it isnt about the individual. Its about the principle of relevant punishment.
Simple question.
Do we punish equally based on the result regardless of the intent.

Seems to me folks on here think im defending the individual.
Not so. He should get what he is due.
My concern goes beyond this incident.

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: doctordandruff  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 12:12

All the facts I got before it became public have been correct so I beleive the information I was given which was it was a premeditated and planned attempt to ensure a fire started and took hold in the DAS unit. The rest in my mind is irrelevant, the comparison to water on the laptop is a joke.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: PARrot  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 12:41

Quote:

doctordandruff, Wed 28 Aug 12:12

All the facts I got before it became public have been correct so I beleive the information I was given which was it was a premeditated and planned attempt to ensure a fire started and took hold in the DAS unit. The rest in my mind is irrelevant, the comparison to water on the laptop is a joke.


Its a joke because you are missing the point.
The cosequences are greater with the school but the principle of punishment for intent versus outcome is relevant.
It seems some don't want to debate that issue though.

How do you know the info you have is all true. Im not saying you dont...just there are several versions available.

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: Captain Desmond Fancey  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 13:18

This might be taken with a slight hint of irony, but it's really time this forum was brought into the 21st century and given an ignore button and then I could happily ignore your absolute drivel.

Right now a number of businesses in Abbey View, Touch, Linburn and Woodmill Roads will be nursing a much emptier till this lunchtime. 1400 children will be kicking their heels, missing out on education and wondering just where they are going to end up learning (even hearing rumours of a school in Perth being able to "take" them), meanwhile there is a 14 year old arsonist sitting on social media receiving messages of defence, love and even support from countless village idiots.

I quite believe his actions were completely deliberate. Whether he considered exactly how much damage would be done is absolutely irrelevant. he purposely set fire to a building - that is arson. And he should feel the full available weight of the law accordingly.

If his life is ruined because of it, then hell mend him.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: jake89  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 13:34

Parrot's laptop analogy is a reasonable one IMO. In his scenario the question would be - did they mean to wet their brother, or did they mean to destroy work on a laptop.

In the school scenario it's still to be seen whether the lad simply wanted to burn a bin (a stupid act) or if he intended to burn the school down (a reckless act).

There are lots of rumours going around so few (I said only the boy would know the truth but accept others will do) will know what the real intent was.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: BigJPar  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 13:36

Quote:

jake89, Wed 28 Aug 13:34

Parrot's laptop analogy is a reasonable one IMO. In his scenario the question would be - did they mean to wet their brother, or did they mean to destroy work on a laptop.

In the school scenario it's still to be seen whether the lad simply wanted to burn a bin (a stupid act) or if he intended to burn the school down (a reckless act).

There are lots of rumours going around so few (I said only the boy would know the truth but accept others will do) will know what the real intent was.


The bin was allegedly chucked onto the school roof.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: PARrot  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 13:53

Quote:

Captain Desmond Fancey, Wed 28 Aug 13:18

This might be taken with a slight hint of irony, but it's really time this forum was brought into the 21st century and given an ignore button and then I could happily ignore your absolute drivel.

Right now a number of businesses in Abbey View, Touch, Linburn and Woodmill Roads will be nursing a much emptier till this lunchtime. 1400 children will be kicking their heels, missing out on education and wondering just where they are going to end up learning (even hearing rumours of a school in Perth being able to "take" them), meanwhile there is a 14 year old arsonist sitting on social media receiving messages of defence, love and even support from countless village idiots.

I quite believe his actions were completely deliberate. Whether he considered exactly how much damage would be done is absolutely irrelevant. he purposely set fire to a building - that is arson. And he should feel the full available weight of the law accordingly.

If his life is ruined because of it, then hell mend him.


Lets stop the personal stuff. Apologies for the fart comment.
No need to start infighting just because we differ in opinion.

Actually we don't differ that much. I agree he should be suitably punished. My only issue in the matter is that if he as I was originally led to believe, set fire to a bin, meaning to burn the bin only then I can find it in myself to feel sorry for him. I still think he should be punished though, but not as severely as if he intended the end result.
You may disagree with that but it isn't drivel.

I can assure you that at 14 years old, I believe he should be punished severely if it was intentional.

I'm not a softy on just punishment. Believe me, if it turns out it was deliberate I will expect him to be suitably punished.

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: BigJPar  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 14:03

Quote:

PARrot, Wed 28 Aug 13:53

Quote:

Captain Desmond Fancey, Wed 28 Aug 13:18

This might be taken with a slight hint of irony, but it's really time this forum was brought into the 21st century and given an ignore button and then I could happily ignore your absolute drivel.

Right now a number of businesses in Abbey View, Touch, Linburn and Woodmill Roads will be nursing a much emptier till this lunchtime. 1400 children will be kicking their heels, missing out on education and wondering just where they are going to end up learning (even hearing rumours of a school in Perth being able to "take" them), meanwhile there is a 14 year old arsonist sitting on social media receiving messages of defence, love and even support from countless village idiots.

I quite believe his actions were completely deliberate. Whether he considered exactly how much damage would be done is absolutely irrelevant. he purposely set fire to a building - that is arson. And he should feel the full available weight of the law accordingly.

If his life is ruined because of it, then hell mend him.


Lets stop the personal stuff. Apologies for the fart comment.
No need to start infighting just because we differ in opinion.

Actually we don't differ that much. I agree he should be suitably punished. My only issue in the matter is that if he as I was originally led to believe, set fire to a bin, meaning to burn the bin only then I can find it in myself to feel sorry for him. I still think he should be punished though, but not as severely as if he intended the end result.
You may disagree with that but it isn't drivel.

I can assure you that at 14 years old, I believe he should be punished severely if it was intentional.

I'm not a softy on just punishment. Believe me, if it turns out it was deliberate I will expect him to be suitably punished.


He should be punished severely. When you put a match to something it burns. At 14 you know that. Do you know the family? You seem to bringing up the accidental line a bit too quickly.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: PARrot  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 14:34

Quote:

BigJPar, Wed 28 Aug 14:03

Quote:

PARrot, Wed 28 Aug 13:53

Quote:

Captain Desmond Fancey, Wed 28 Aug 13:18

This might be taken with a slight hint of irony, but it's really time this forum was brought into the 21st century and given an ignore button and then I could happily ignore your absolute drivel.

Right now a number of businesses in Abbey View, Touch, Linburn and Woodmill Roads will be nursing a much emptier till this lunchtime. 1400 children will be kicking their heels, missing out on education and wondering just where they are going to end up learning (even hearing rumours of a school in Perth being able to "take" them), meanwhile there is a 14 year old arsonist sitting on social media receiving messages of defence, love and even support from countless village idiots.

I quite believe his actions were completely deliberate. Whether he considered exactly how much damage would be done is absolutely irrelevant. he purposely set fire to a building - that is arson. And he should feel the full available weight of the law accordingly.

If his life is ruined because of it, then hell mend him.


Lets stop the personal stuff. Apologies for the fart comment.
No need to start infighting just because we differ in opinion.

Actually we don't differ that much. I agree he should be suitably punished. My only issue in the matter is that if he as I was originally led to believe, set fire to a bin, meaning to burn the bin only then I can find it in myself to feel sorry for him. I still think he should be punished though, but not as severely as if he intended the end result.
You may disagree with that but it isn't drivel.

I can assure you that at 14 years old, I believe he should be punished severely if it was intentional.

I'm not a softy on just punishment. Believe me, if it turns out it was deliberate I will expect him to be suitably punished.


He should be punished severely. When you put a match to something it burns. At 14 you know that. Do you know the family? You seem to bringing up the accidental line a bit too quickly.


No and I have no interest in them either. I came across the mothers post and shared a link so her post could be seen and maybe balance the comments a bit.

Since then I have been concerned more with the issues ive highlighted more than the individual.

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: moviescot  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 15:07

Quote:

Raymie the Legend, Tue 27 Aug 23:03

I'm told that the fire would never have spread so far in days gone by when firemen could fight the fire from within.
I do appreciate it that it's better to lose a building than a firefighter.


Firefighters can put out a fire in a building but not a building on fire. I would imagine the age of this property probably meant it was the latter.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: veteraneastender  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 15:49

Somebody mentioned that Clackmannanshire could possibly rehouse some of the displaced WHS pupils.

I doubt that would be a runner in practice - Alloa Academy is already "temporarily" hosting a Primary school which is closed due to flooding problems from surrounding fields.

That apart, physical accommodation is only part of the big picture problem - there are other significant issues.

A lot of kids in senior school will have lost course work from last session, and re-deploying teaching and auxiliary staff will be another headache - transport and school meals is another logistical problem.

On lesser critical matters, it will almost certainly mean an end to extra curricular activities and schools sports etc.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: sammer  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 16:15

Hi Grant,
I suppose architecture comes down to personal taste and I don’t want to become all Prince Charles about modern architecture. What concerns me is that schools should be built to last, as the ones from the Victorian and Edwardian eras clearly were, as well as being comfortable places to work in; they should not be vanity projects for local councils nor a nice little earner for the construction companies. As a former pupil of Woodmill JHS as it was at the time I still have a picture of it being quite a modern school; I was surprised to hear it was earmarked for replacement.

CDF seems particularly concerned for the effect the school closure will have on local businesses, an issue that few of us would have had the foresight to consider. The service small shops give to youngsters in providing crisps, juice, chocolate, bubblegum and in my day 3d single cigarettes is often overlooked and he deserves credit for highlighting this.

A few hundred yards from the Woodmill site is another of my alma maters, the now demolished Blacklaw Primary School. I gather that the Thatcherite principle of parental choice led to the school becoming undersubscribed, albeit its illuminati include not just my good self but many leading figures in the town, as well as the celebrated criminal lawyer and gay activist Derek Ogg. Had the building (built in 1953) been mothballed and maintained then it could have been used for unseen eventualities such as this, but then that would have been putting service before economics.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: Ben,D.A  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 16:30

I'm with you sammer, you only have to look at the debauchle of Edinburgh in resent years. Brand new schools built and having to be closed for repair due to walls collapsing, wrong wall ties used and harling falling of as well as ceilings collapsing. These Schools were only months to years old and as the company that built them, they went out of business and repairs were paid for that cost the price of a brand new Primary. will hate to see the conditions of these places in 10 years never mind 80.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: Playup_Pompey  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 17:05

£50,000 donation from Sky has been made to the recovery plan to assist with resources etc in the immediate short term.

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: BigJPar  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 17:10

Quote:

Playup_Pompey, Wed 28 Aug 17:05

£50,000 donation from Sky has been made to the recovery plan to assist with resources etc in the immediate short term.


Good effort. Would be nice for Amazon to chip in too.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: Johan_Cruyff  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 17:52

This might be a totally off the wall idea - but the problem of rehousing the students is constrained by times- School is 8-3pm (or thereabouts)

So why not have Woodmill students attend DHS 4-10pm every day or something like that ? I get its not without challenges of childcare and asking teachers to work weird hours but could be a short term fix ?

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: JTH123  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 17:53

That's very impressive from Sky.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: SergioDuarte  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 17:59

The mother is clearly an absolute cretin with about 50 bairns to different dads. There’s a reason the wee rodent has run amok ! Utter utter scum. Up there with that scumbag family from Glenrothes that terrorised the area in the 90s. Vermin of the highest order and should be dealt with extreme prejudice.



Post Edited (Wed 28 Aug 18:00)
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: PARrot  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 18:20

Way too far. Even for an expert fisherman like yourself.

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: P  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 18:24

How about a different analogy PARrot relating to intention and consequences - how about if he stabbed someone with the intent to scare them with a slash but the consequence is death through hitting an artery. How then do you suggest intent v consequence should be considered in the response?
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: Grant  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 18:36

Were they clearly? There's been hundreds of buildings from that era that have been knocked down, those that haven't I suppose you could say are ones of significance and as such have listed status, the maintenance cost of such buildings are usually quite large, the amount of progress made in building regulations in a hundreds year is enormous as I'm sure you can imagine, look at the steps in heating, plumbing and electrical sectors? Buildings such as the schools you mentioned have no historical significance as such, and as such why would you spend a bomb maintaining the building? Why not build a new one with better facilities and as such a better experience for the kids? Surely the most important thing.

Your suggestion for Blacklaw doesn't stack up, from what I remember it was knocked down in 2005? That's 14 years ago man and this is literally the first time it would have been needed, can you imagine the costs of that? The drain on council tax?
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: londonparsfan  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 18:38

This is going to be my only post on this thread as I don't know any of the facts as to what actually happened but intent matters pretty significantly in law, that's why there are separate offences for murder and manslaughter (and a whole host of other charges that get split when there is provable intent or there isn't).

When a court deems there was no intent to commit a crime then they'll also look at other factors such as recklessness/wilful disregard for safety etc which can often bump up the severity of a charge or the punishment handed down for a lesser crime.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: Parplod  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 18:49

Thinking outside the box Johan Cruyff and an interesting concept. Sadly unlikely to gain support in this day and age. Similar to us having huge waiting lists for MRI/CT scans but the scanners lie redundant for 16 hours a day.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: JTH123  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 19:03

Quote:

Parplod, Wed 28 Aug 18:49

Thinking outside the box Johan Cruyff and an interesting concept. Sadly unlikely to gain support in this day and age. Similar to us having huge waiting lists for MRI/CT scans but the scanners lie redundant for 16 hours a day.


I agree but kids finishing at 10pm probably not realistic. 4-7 with the balance of schoolwork done in daytime would work but I'm lucky in that my mother in law could be around for my 2 in daytime. Lots of families won't have that luxury hence they seem to be pushing for solutions for normal school hours even if it involves travelling.
There's an update on the school website about the short term plans. They seem to have found a place for the s5 & s6 and also the DAS kids. That leaves 1000 kids from s1 to s4.
My money is still on cabins for at least some of them. It's a tried and tested approach and it can be implemented fairly quickly.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: ipswichpar  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 19:05

And an enormous logistical challenge to schedule the teachers.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: jake89  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 19:30

Cabins on the playing fields would probably be the easiest solution provider enough can be sourced that have the right facilities. Problem will be all the equipment. All those computers, tech machinery and science materials.

Bussing some out and not others is difficult as each teacher has multiple classes so you'd end up limiting subject choices for Nats and Highers.

It's a logistical nightmare.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: PARrot  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 20:00

Quote:

P, Wed 28 Aug 18:24

How about a different analogy PARrot relating to intention and consequences - how about if he stabbed someone with the intent to scare them with a slash but the consequence is death through hitting an artery. How then do you suggest intent v consequence should be considered in the response?


Thats a good point P.
I think we could make many analogies and they would all warrant different levels of response.

To get back to this one. I am not defending the individuaI but I think that suitable punishment should reflect the intent.
You could add to that the capacity of the perpetrator and the likelyhood of the final consequences as far as it could be reasonably expected for a person with that capacity to comprehend.
The final outcome will not be the only factor taken into consideration.

To relate this incident to your analogy, if he set fire to a bin that was in a position that any reasonable 14 year old would realise it was going to spread to the building it would merit a much stiffer sentence than if the bin was a distance from the building. Just as any reasonable 14 year old would expect a stab is likely to do more damage than just scare someone.



Post Edited (Wed 28 Aug 20:08)
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: JTH123  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 20:13

Jake89 it's not all that uncommon to have a whole school in cabins and there are specialists who are geared up to provide them.
I'd hazard that it's a good time as well because the schools in England are going back next week so there could be some sites that have just finished with theirs. School build programmes always target moving in to a new building at holidays, preferably summer if possible.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: BigJPar  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 20:23

Quote:

PARrot, Wed 28 Aug 20:00

Quote:

P, Wed 28 Aug 18:24

How about a different analogy PARrot relating to intention and consequences - how about if he stabbed someone with the intent to scare them with a slash but the consequence is death through hitting an artery. How then do you suggest intent v consequence should be considered in the response?


Thats a good point P.
I think we could make many analogies and they would all warrant different levels of response.

To get back to this one. I am not defending the individuaI but I think that suitable punishment should reflect the intent.
You could add to that the capacity of the perpetrator and the likelyhood of the final consequences as far as it could be reasonably expected for a person with that capacity to comprehend.
The final outcome will not be the only factor taken into consideration.

To relate this incident to your analogy, if he set fire to a bin that was in a position that any reasonable 14 year old would realise it was going to spread to the building it would merit a much stiffer sentence than if the bin was a distance from the building. Just as any reasonable 14 year old would expect a stab is likely to do more damage than just scare someone.


Yep, it might come down to where the bin was......
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: twin par  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 20:41

Sergio nails it.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: jake89  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 20:52

That's good to hear JTH.

Was just announced S5/6 will be back next week. Assume they must be able to use part of the building that isn't damaged. They still need to find solutions for S1-4.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: JTH123  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 21:12

The s5 and s6 are back next week but I'm not convinced they will be at Woodmill. The announcement tonight doesn't say either way but there could be a clue where, talking about the identity of the pupils regardless of where they are taught, the head said "we're all sad to have lost our school building but ..... we are Woodmill..."
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: doctordandruff  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 21:28

Yeah, rumour I heard is S5 and 6 are up at the college. Also heard the nearest high school with capacity is Lochgelly. Keeping the peace will be a nightmare.

I struggle to understand how they will manage teachers over many sites as they obviously teach across the years. I assume for this reason getting them back on site at Woodmill will ne a main push, even if it means 30 portakabins.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: PARrot  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 22:33

Quote:

BigJPar, Wed 28 Aug 20:23

Quote:

PARrot, Wed 28 Aug 20:00

Quote:

P, Wed 28 Aug 18:24

How about a different analogy PARrot relating to intention and consequences - how about if he stabbed someone with the intent to scare them with a slash but the consequence is death through hitting an artery. How then do you suggest intent v consequence should be considered in the response?


Thats a good point P.
I think we could make many analogies and they would all warrant different levels of response.

To get back to this one. I am not defending the individuaI but I think that suitable punishment should reflect the intent.
You could add to that the capacity of the perpetrator and the likelyhood of the final consequences as far as it could be reasonably expected for a person with that capacity to comprehend.
The final outcome will not be the only factor taken into consideration.

To relate this incident to your analogy, if he set fire to a bin that was in a position that any reasonable 14 year old would realise it was going to spread to the building it would merit a much stiffer sentence than if the bin was a distance from the building. Just as any reasonable 14 year old would expect a stab is likely to do more damage than just scare someone.


Yep, it might come down to where the bin was......


You're still not getting it aren't you.
But oddly enough, if a bin was involved then yes its placement probably will be taken into account.

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: sammer  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 22:52

Grant,
You clearly place economics before service. Being older I suspect, I still retain that quaint old idea of public service. That applies to politicians, teachers and local councillors who should provide a good service for what they are paid, but not necessarily a profit. A man who knows the price of everything and the value of nothing has failed in his civic responsibilities. Blacklaw School was worth mothballing for emergencies. Look at the crisis now and ponder on your spreadsheet and see how wise that judgment was.

Huts will be the answer to the Woodmill dilemma. They are nothing new. My parents were taught in tin huts in Queen Anne mid war. At Woodmill JHS in the mid 1960s, the era of the entitled baby boomers as we are now told, there were 10 wooden huts when I was there, and there were another 10 huts, some concrete some wooden, at Dunfermline HS when I was afforded entry after that. Quite often, whisper it, the huts were actually preferred by teachers and students to the main building since they were better to sit in. But of course we are not supposed to say that in case the construction companies building their shoddy wares are offended.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: Wotsit  
Date:   Wed 28 Aug 23:14

Quote:

P, Wed 28 Aug 18:24

How about a different analogy PARrot relating to intention and consequences - how about if he stabbed someone with the intent to scare them with a slash but the consequence is death through hitting an artery. How then do you suggest intent v consequence should be considered in the response?


That's a pretty perfect example of the difference between manslaughter and murder: did they go into it with the intent to kill?

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: veteraneastender  
Date:   Thu 29 Aug 08:47

If you go about committing wilful fire raising (not called arson in Scotland) then there is a very high risk that a small fire can/will become a major blaze very easily and quickly.

The “only” a rubbish bin defence is nonsense - people should be held responsible for their actions in proportion to the crime.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: PARrot  
Date:   Thu 29 Aug 09:30

Quote:

veteraneastender, Thu 29 Aug 08:47

If you go about committing wilful fire raising (not called arson in Scotland) then there is a very high risk that a small fire can/will become a major blaze very easily and quickly.

The “only” a rubbish bin defence is nonsense - people should be held responsible for their actions in proportion to the crime.


The intended crime or the outcome?
Taking capacoty into consideration or not?

The question was answered further up.
Intent is relevant in judgement.

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: Grant  
Date:   Thu 29 Aug 11:24

Look at my spreadsheet? What are you on about man?

I don't work for the council I'm just looking at this logically, you wanted the council to mothball a school on the off chance something would happen? The costs accrued over that time of mothballing the school, keeping it serviceable and providing security would be a massive, humungous drain on council tax, on your basis of thinking you seem to think service costs nothing, money doesn't grow on trees.

Not only that how much use would it be now, 300 spaces? Fat lot of good that would do, you'd achieve the same with huts and it will cost a whole lot less than keeping an empty building for years.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: sammer  
Date:   Thu 29 Aug 11:59

There was nearer 500 pupils at Blacklaw when I was there; maybe why we had a decent record in football competitions. For a person who seems intent on keeping the purse strings tight, fearful of the cost in terms of council tax, you seem very liberal in your attitude to building new schools which are only needed because you have knocked down the previous one.

Any organisation needs spare capacity otherwise it is in dereliction of duty. Money may not grow on trees, but the fabled magic money tree is always available for wars or propaganda regarding brexit or prior to a General Election. An electorate which granted money for these enterprises yet denied money to educate its own children would deservedly live in ignorance.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: Grant  
Date:   Thu 29 Aug 12:43

Nearer 500?
https://researchbriefings.parliament.uk/ResearchBriefing/Summary/SN02625#targetText=Since%201950%20the%20average%20size,slighty%20to%20around%20260%20pupils.

You're saying that Blacklaw was double the size of an average primary school aye?

I seem very Liberal on building new schools? When it gets to the stage where the maintenance of a building becomes prohibitive then yes, build a new school. I'm all for improving the educational experience of kids, going by your logic you'd like to use education money on maintaining empty buildings for 250 non existant kids.

There will be spare capacity for kids in West Fife, to the extent of 1400 though? I fail to see how that's a dereliction of duty, the biggest dereliction of duty in this example is the parents of the bottom that set the school on fire.

People donate money for election campaigns/brexit campaigns, absolutely no one in there right mind is donating money to have a building empty, which in this instance would make barely a dent in the problem facing the people doing the relocation of students.

You're absolutely havering here.



Post Edited (Thu 29 Aug 12:45)
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: widtink  
Date:   Thu 29 Aug 12:53

Quote:

Grant, Thu 29 Aug 12:43

Nearer 500?
https://researchbriefings.parliament.uk/ResearchBriefing/Summary/SN02625#targetText=Since%201950%20the%20average%20size,slighty%20to%20around%20260%20pupils.

Link fixed



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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: Grant  
Date:   Thu 29 Aug 13:09

Shame it's roughly 7 miles long.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: veteraneastender  
Date:   Thu 29 Aug 13:09

"Intent is relevant in judgement."

Aye, wilful fire raising - premeditated, no accident.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: BigJPar  
Date:   Thu 29 Aug 13:24

Quote:

veteraneastender, Thu 29 Aug 13:09

"Intent is relevant in judgement."

Aye, wilful fire raising - premeditated, no accident.


Perhaps with a grudge against the place.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: parsfan  
Date:   Thu 29 Aug 14:18

If they'd mothballed Blacklaw (or Pitcorthie) it would have been burnt down within the year.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
The universe is ruled by chance and indifference
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: Playup_Pompey  
Date:   Thu 29 Aug 14:22

there is the old inverkeithing primary school building... oh actually

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: widtink  
Date:   Thu 29 Aug 14:30

Here's a question....
I take it the days where the "jannie" lived on site in a hoose are well gone?
I'm trying to think of a school that still has a jannies hoose on site but I can't think of one.
There was certainly no nonsense back then around schools at night cos the jannie would come oot and kick yer erchie if ye were up to no good.



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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: Turps  
Date:   Thu 29 Aug 14:52

Lynburn but I doubt it's the janitor who lives there now.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: ipswichpar  
Date:   Thu 29 Aug 15:48

The tide seemed to turn against jannies when Mr Brown stood in front of DHS S6 and declared "The Janny is a W***".

Dont tell me the Canmore janny house is no more?!?
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: JTH123  
Date:   Thu 29 Aug 15:59

Quote:

ipswichpar, Thu 29 Aug 15:48

The tide seemed to turn against jannies when Mr Brown stood in front of DHS S6 and declared "The Janny is a W***".

Dont tell me the Canmore janny house is no more?!?


I'm reliably informed that the Canmore janny still lives in the house. Hasn't stopped the school being vandalised to the extent that some windows have had to be fitted with shutters. There have been small fires as well.
To be honest if I was a janny I wouldn't go out after groups of kids causing bother. No telling what would happen these days.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: ipswichpar  
Date:   Thu 29 Aug 16:03

At one point I was sure Mr Burns could handle any bother that came his way, but the day he was temporarily rendered incapacitated by a wasp that had crawled into his shoe changed that.

Discretion is often the better part of valour these days I'm afraid.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: sammer  
Date:   Thu 29 Aug 17:31

Blacklaw School had 16 classrooms when I was a pupil with an average of at least 30 per class; there are school photos to substantiate that. Well over 400 and nearer 500 pupils in total, controlled by around a dozen belts and a jannie (who later became the DAFC groundsman.)

It’s curious that fee-paying schools rarely seem to have problems maintaining their original buildings, and don’t prioritise a new building as a way to improving the educational experience. I’ll wait a long time until either Fettes or Eton are knocked down since they are deemed no longer fit for purpose. If they have the money to renovate then so should the state schools.

So long as we judge education differently from defence we shall unfortunately get the schools we deserve. There are around 70,000 soldiers in the UK armed forces although we have not been invaded for over 200 years; this is never questioned on grounds of expenditure. We also have a nuclear deterrent which costs around 1 billion pounds a year to maintain, which has never been used and in truth it is impossible to imagine a scenario in which it would ever be used. Again, this is little questioned. Yet when I proposed mothballing a small school, rather than pay to have it knocked down, this is apparently an exorbitant waste of money. A teenage hooligan is understandably being lambasted for burning down half a school but it appears the school was going to be demolished anyhow. He is a vandal for sure, but an amateur at the game.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: P  
Date:   Thu 29 Aug 17:53

I’m pretty sure trident is questioned on a pretty regular basis.
We can barely get our bins emptied never mind maintain an empty school which wouldn’t have solved the problem anyway 😂.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: PARrot  
Date:   Thu 29 Aug 17:56

The neuclear arsenal is used every day. As a deterrant and as a ticket to the table that discusses the issues regarding the same.
Lets hope it never has to be "Used" used.

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: jake89  
Date:   Thu 29 Aug 18:46

Sammer, much of the Mary Erskine/Stewart Melville schools are not the original buildings. Over the years there's been various extensions. The more elite private schools maintain their old buildings at a significant cost. They do so not out of a love for the history of the buildings but more because of the prestige.

If you look in Dunfermline you can guarantee the Carnegie Centre will outlive the Glenrothes centre, but it'll also cost significantly more (less said about the final upgrade costs the better!).
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: Johan_Cruyff  
Date:   Thu 29 Aug 19:25

Wood mill has a jannies house at the entrance to the community use facilities. No idea who lives there.

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: JTH123  
Date:   Thu 29 Aug 19:55

Hearing tonight that demolition to start quickly. It's unclear exactly how much will be coming down just now though.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: veteraneastender  
Date:   Thu 29 Aug 20:01

"I take it the days where the "jannie" lived on site in a hoose are well gone?"

Mostly, but not always.

Lornshill Academy here has two janny's houses on campus.

Nearly all Primary schools now don't - janny's don't want to be bothered when off duty by punters coming to their door with some minor complaint or enquiry etc.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: charlie1  
Date:   Thu 29 Aug 20:21

Quote:

JTH123, Thu 29 Aug 19:55

Hearing tonight that demolition to start quickly. It's unclear exactly how much will be coming down just now though.


Starting on DAS tomorrow
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: charlie1  
Date:   Thu 29 Aug 20:27

DAS users moving to Blair Hall Primary
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: renegade master  
Date:   Thu 29 Aug 20:34

Posted from the Android app Topic Originator: Johan_Cruyff like | nolike
Date: Thu 29 Aug 19:25

Wood mill has a jannies house at the entrance to the community use facilities. No idea who lives there.


It's my Aunties house, my Uncle was the Janitor for many years and my Auntie worked in the School too.

It's longer connected to the school.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: DulochConvert  
Date:   Thu 29 Aug 20:59

Anyone know from tonight’s meetings where S5 & S6 are going, is it the college?
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: craigypar35  
Date:   Thu 29 Aug 21:04

I was at the S5 meeting with my daughter. S5 going to Carnegie Conference Centre from Monday. Rector is hoping all school will come back together at woodmill by Xmas/January. A lot of hurdles to be jumped though.Really tough time for everyone but school staff working round the clock to get pupils back in a classroom.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: DulochConvert  
Date:   Thu 29 Aug 21:24

Glad to hear they are keeping the year together and found a home for the senior school so quickly, every week is important for them.
Slightly more lucky for us, S1 & S2 but yeah tough times and incredible impressed at the way this disaster is being dealt with by the authorities and the community.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: craigypar35  
Date:   Thu 29 Aug 21:29

Indeed not easy but community pulling together. S6 are going to St. Columbus
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: EEP  
Date:   Thu 29 Aug 21:47

It must be an absolute nightmare to organise and credit to the school and council for keeping parents updated.
I came home for lunch and my daughter (S4) and her 2 pals were doing work the school has gave them. Now that was a shock but they said it’s the most work they have done as there was no interruptions as there were idiots who cause nothing but grief in their class...😳
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: JTH123  
Date:   Thu 29 Aug 21:54

Quote:

DulochConvert, Thu 29 Aug 21:24 incredible impressed at the way this disaster is being dealt with by the authorities and the community.


Totally agree with you. They've put out one main communication every night about what's been sorted out that day. They are obviously prioritising DAS and senior pupils which makes sense. The most impressive thing is to hear that they think they can accommodate the S1-4 in year groups within West Fife.
Also interesting to see the communication of tonight say "there are parts of the building we won't be able to salvage...". Fairly obvious I know but that suggests that it's not all coming down.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: craigypar35  
Date:   Thu 29 Aug 21:55

Jeremy Corbyn is seemingly up in Scotland for a few days and was round at woodmill seeing the school this afternoon.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: JTH123  
Date:   Thu 29 Aug 22:00

Brave move decanting the Blairhall kids to Tulliallan to accommodate the DAS. I can imagine there'll be a good few people upset at that.

Post Edited (Thu 29 Aug 22:00)
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: Grant  
Date:   Thu 29 Aug 23:11

Pitcorthie was as big/bigger than Blacklaw, at no point did it have 500 pupils, similarly neither did Blacklaw, I've posted up the closest thing you could have to proof, if you've got something better then batter on, as it is, we'll go with the facts, cheers.

It's not curious in the slightest that fee paying schools have more money to maintain costly buildings, I mean you've literally said it yourself there so I'm not sure how you don't get it! Eton is the second biggest landowner in the UK after the Queens Estates, Woodmill is a public school in Abbey view, who do you think will have more money to maintain a costly old building?

The UK was invaded in the 1940s.

Trident is constantly questioned.

It's funny you call it a small school by the end of your post, you'd have everyone believe it was actually double the size of the average primary school at the start of it.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: twin par  
Date:   Thu 29 Aug 23:54

Having been at woodmill ,early seventies, I absolutely hated it.School was full of local bullies and teachers who were bullies themselves. Learned more at old Lauder tech,in a year ,than three years at woodmill.Classes were full of disruptive thugs,don't mean any harm to school as such,but have painful memories of it.

Post Edited (Thu 29 Aug 23:54)
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: DulochConvert  
Date:   Fri 30 Aug 00:05

The Channel Islands fall into two separate self-governing bailiwicks, the Bailiwick of Guernsey and the Bailiwick of Jersey. Both are British Crown dependencies, and neither is part of the United Kingdom

But on a more serious point, would it not make more sense for a continuous renewal programme for infrastructure. Every region is made to produce a 15 year development plan, its at this point these decisions should be decided and funded.
It’s a crazy situation that local councils have to fund future developments before they have the income, it produces the tape over crack mentality. Surely the role of central government at the 15 and 10 year stage is to identify schools like major transportation and build it.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: Thaipar  
Date:   Fri 30 Aug 00:33

Quote:

Johan_Cruyff, Thu 29 Aug 19:25that would be Mrs Burns. Her along with Mrs Kirk were a force to be reckoned with in the community center. S

Wood mill has a jannies house at the entrance to the community use facilities.
Sadly that was Mandy Burns home also who as we know passed Away with Norrie.
The other jannies house on Shields Road is occupied by a former Jannie at woodmill. Frc sold these houses off as obviously they brought in some much needed capital.

Please don't book me Admin, it will ruin my life.

Post Edited (Fri 30 Aug 00:36)
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: GG Riva  
Date:   Fri 30 Aug 07:08

Quote:

JTH123, Thu 29 Aug 22:00

Brave move decanting the Blairhall kids to Tulliallan to accommodate the DAS. I can imagine there'll be a good few people upset at that.


Are you sure you've got that right, JTH ? I was told the DAS pupils were going to Tulliallan, so maybe some Tulliallan kids are going up to Blairhall. I believe the two schools have the same Head teacher.

Eta. You'd hope folk would put any selfish considerations aside in the current circumstances.



Not your average Sunday League player.


Post Edited (Fri 30 Aug 07:17)
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: Captain Desmond Fancey  
Date:   Fri 30 Aug 07:51

I believe local residents were receiving letters through their door yesterday advising that demolition of the single storey part (presumably DAS) will be starting today.

Like a previous poster I have been incredibly impressed by the way the school and local authority have handled things since the fire. Also the way the community and local business have got involved and assisted has been genuinely heartwarming (yes, I do have one).


The good old days
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: allparone  
Date:   Fri 30 Aug 07:54

JTH is correct GG.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: GG Riva  
Date:   Fri 30 Aug 08:48

Quote:

allparone, Fri 30 Aug 07:54

JTH is correct GG.


And I thought my source was reliable since he has a strong connection with Woodmill.



Not your average Sunday League player.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: Captain Desmond Fancey  
Date:   Fri 30 Aug 11:07

Confirmed now that S5 pupils will attend Fife College and S6 will be at St Columbas as from Monday.

Good that these kids can once again concentrate on their studies.


The good old days
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: Playup_Pompey  
Date:   Fri 30 Aug 12:57

s1 at Vine conference centre starting Tuesday
s2 dedicated space at queen anne from 6th sept
s3 beath high from Thursday
s4 inverkeithing high from Wednesday





Post Edited (Fri 30 Aug 14:02)
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: JTH123  
Date:   Fri 30 Aug 14:00

Yep. They've done well. Phased start over a number of days is a good idea as well. Gives them a fighting chance to resolve teething problems each day.

Confirmed that DAS has exclusive use of Blairhall PS.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: EEP  
Date:   Fri 30 Aug 14:25

S4 pupils will be relocated to Inverkeithing High starting on Wednesday.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: Parplod  
Date:   Fri 30 Aug 14:32

Hopefully someone will collate an impact assessment including not only the physical cost of damage to the buildings, but also that of all the disruption to hundreds of families across Fife. This should be made available to the court.
Good luck to everyone as they resume their education next week.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: GG Riva  
Date:   Fri 30 Aug 14:48

Quote:

JTH123, Fri 30 Aug 14:00

Yep. They've done well. Phased start over a number of days is a good idea as well. Gives them a fighting chance to resolve teething problems each day.

Confirmed that DAS has exclusive use of Blairhall PS.


My source has back tracked, JTH. In his defence, he said that this was not the original plan but it is better as the DAS kids, as you say, will have the school to themselves, whereas at Tulliallan they'd have been sharing with the local children. They will find it hard enough to cope with the change, without having to try to integrate with the local children.



Not your average Sunday League player.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: jake89  
Date:   Fri 30 Aug 15:26

Seems really well coordinated. Hope the kids aren't too disrupted.

Hopefully this accelerates the progress on replacement buildings for Woodmill and St C's (as well as Fife College's Halbeath campus). I'm sure the site may be unpopular amongst those in Abbeyview but the reality is that most of the Woodmill catchment must be in Duloch and Masterton.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: JTH123  
Date:   Fri 30 Aug 16:05

It's not a competition GG!😉
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: kelty_par  
Date:   Fri 30 Aug 17:05

Good to see they got something sorted but it will still be a logistical nightmare with staffing (they surely won't be going from site to site), Guidance teachers especially; schools doing different subjects (maybe an S4 pupil doing Spanish finds there is no Spanish teacher at Inverkiething and their teacher is at Fife College with the Higher class etc), schools doing different numbers of classes, S5 and S6 pupils being in separate locations but presumably in S5/6 National 5 or Higher classes, etc. It's an almost impossible task
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: StevenPar77  
Date:   Fri 30 Aug 18:54

Kelty, I think teachers are being pulled from other schools to help out.

http://www.agiftfor.net
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: JTH123  
Date:   Fri 30 Aug 19:13

There will clearly be challenges Kelty but to be fair to those involved they've coped so far.
As was said today, let's not forget that on Monday the building was still burning. They've achieved a lot.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: LochgellyAlbert  
Date:   Fri 30 Aug 21:01

The aftermath!
https://www.altizure.com/project-model?pid=5d66cf810b9fdd7b23bf1414&render=texture&campose=false
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: EEP  
Date:   Fri 30 Aug 22:00

Looking at that then the whole school needs demolished. There is a lot more damage than I first saw.
I realise there has been a lot off people involved but the head at Woodmill Mr Macintosh has been superb. My lass in S4 can’t praise him high enough as he’s always trying to help pupils out.
There’s going to be loads of problems with pupils in different schools but it will settle down.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: sammer  
Date:   Sun 1 Sep 18:51

A few days ago Grant was sceptical that Blacklaw Primary School ever had 500 pupils. In fact it seems I actually underestimated the school roll. Here is a summation from the former Depute Head of Blacklaw, a man beyond reproach since he is not only a season ticket holder at EEP but is part of a select group of around a dozen people old enough to have seen Charlie Dickson score his first goals in a black and white jersey. On that occasion my former teacher, then a schoolboy, travelled through to Stenhousemuir in 1955 in the back of a furniture van to see our latest centre forward make his debut. He paid around 1/- at the gate and got memories to last a lifetime. What a journey. Few Pars fans since have made a better one.

‘My wife taught at Pitcorthie, and she shares my feeling that Blacklaw was the first, Pitcorthie was close behind, and then Lynburn joined the triumvirate. It follows then, that just before the new schools actually opened to relieve pressure, first Blacklaw alone, then Blacklaw and Pitcorthie were absolutely bursting at the seams….…I went in 1975 as HT to South Parks, Glenrothes, a fairly similar design to Blacklaw though with 18 classrooms {Blacklaw had 16}, and the roll was over 600….….Now all the above is a bit OTT in response to your original query, but it all confirms and consolidates my memory that Blacklaw's roll was around the 600 mark in its heyday, ie the early to mid-60s. Your 480 idea might have prevailed in the 70s, and if your friend {Grant} is a good bit younger, then his lower estimate would probably equate to his time in Pitcorthie.’

Class sizes of 40 pupils were common until the early 1970s, although I doubt many of today’s teachers would think it was possible to teach such numbers. It clearly was, in fact Chinese schools still had classes with that number when I was there a few years back. I hope Michael Gove does not visit this site
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: Skerla  
Date:   Sun 1 Sep 20:16

At least you’re not bothered sammer.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: PARrot  
Date:   Sun 1 Sep 20:21

I was at Pitcorthie in the late 60s what was your wifes nae or did she teach later.

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: EEP  
Date:   Sun 1 Sep 21:59

And what is your point about Woodmill Sammer?
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: sammer  
Date:   Sun 1 Sep 22:21

Hi Skerla,
Since my former primary school was demolished and one of my secondary schools has been burnt to the ground I do feel some sense of loss. Grant was less than polite in his scepticism about the numbers and I feel entitled to set the record straight, so far as I am able.

Hi Parrot,
I was actually quoting a former Blacklaw teacher of mine who married a teacher from Pitcorthie, so she would have been there as a teacher in the bursting at the seams days of the early to mid 1960s, slightly before your time.
The Blacklaw v Pitcorthie football team clashes were on a par with the Old Firm when I was a pupil. (Or so it seemed.) When we beat Pitcorthie in a Cup Final in 1966 our left winger was a talented lad but was being given some physical stick by his opponent, so his mother, who was French and had been going through the French swearing dictionary, tried to get on the park and sort him out. Tommy McDonald, the ex-Par, refereed that game.

Hi EEP,
My point regarding Woodmill School is that a school built around 1960 should still be capable of operating unless it was not built properly in the first place. Either the plan was to knock down a perfectly good building (anticipated by our local arsonist) or it was not good enough to be maintained. I noticed in the Arbroath highlights a very sturdy, stone built school still standing behind the goal where we lost the goal. If we build good schools then we can build a good society. Building new ‘state of the art’ schools every 50 years is a false economy when, like Inverkeithing, no one wants to work in them.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: widtink  
Date:   Sun 1 Sep 22:38

It's not just schools though is it... Look at newly built houses compared to houses that were built 60, 70, or even 100 years ago.
Built to last in them days.



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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: Mr Mac  
Date:   Sun 1 Sep 23:38

Many buildings of that era were built using what were then experimental building techniques. Often not fully understood but chosen as a display of "modernity" as the country tried to demonstrate progress following the immediate post-war period; many of which have not stood the test of time well.



Post Edited (Sun 01 Sep 23:39)
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: davepars  
Date:   Mon 2 Sep 17:30

Topic Originator: renegade master like | nolike
Date: Thu 29 Aug 20:34

Posted from the Android app Topic Originator: Johan_Cruyff like | nolike
Date: Thu 29 Aug 19:25

Wood mill has a jannies house at the entrance to the community use facilities. No idea who lives there.


"It's my Aunties house, my Uncle was the Janitor for many years and my Auntie worked in the School too.

It's longer connected to the school "



Close Renegade, but your uncle I think was my grandad. He was the supervisor of janitors in Fife.

Bob Wise was the jannie, and he lived in the Shields Road house.....still does.

The house at the community entrance used to be the headmasters a long, long time ago.

Funnily enough, Mr Burns was my grandad and was alluded to in another post about a wasp in his shoe.....He was the jannie at Canmore before he got promoted.

Funny wee world we live in.



Post Edited (Mon 02 Sep 17:32)
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: jake89  
Date:   Mon 2 Sep 19:14

Modern houses are far better built than Victorian homes. It's complete myth that they're better built. Prior to buildings being listed these old properties were regularly torn down.

To give you an example. My modern house is around the same size as my in-laws Victorian house. I pay around £90pm for gas and elec. They pay £250! They've had issues with damp as a result of cracked cast iron gutters. This has happened twice and both times required redecoration due to the water penetrating the wall. The building is slightly off-kilter in places due to subsidence, the attic had to get treated for an infestation of wood worm and the floor boards have gaps.

This is a house that has been well maintained over the years but needs TLC due to its age. They've wanted to fit double glazing to improve efficiency but aren't allowed what they want. They also can't put in a driveway.

If it was a 70s house with similar issues you'd just knock it down and build new. But people see value in these old houses in the same way they do with classic cars so they get kept.

New builds get a bad rep from certain mass house builders doing a crap job. However, I'll bet the crap ones are in the minority or the complaints are a result of people with incredibly high expectations of what £250k can buy you.

I'll not go into all the shady building practices I found on my old 1950s built house...
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: rikaka  
Date:   Mon 2 Sep 19:43

Not sure how well your new build will be standing in 100 years time though....
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: red-star-par  
Date:   Mon 2 Sep 21:17

Quote:

rikaka, Mon 2 Sep 19:43

Not sure how well your new build will be standing in 100 years time though....


My thoughts exactly. Many builders I know have told me by the time the mortgages have been paid off, that's when further deep pockets will be needed. New builds in general are rubbish
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: jake89  
Date:   Mon 2 Sep 21:37

My new build is nearly 20 so if your builder's right then it should be due to collapse! My parents one is 36 so it's well past it and it's days are numbered!

When people talk about these old buildings they conveniently forget all the Victorian buildings that were torn down. There were loads of tenements in Edinburgh ripped down because they'd fallen to pieces. The modern ones need regular maintenance to stop them falling apart. One of the ones I lived in had its creaky single glazed windows held in with newspaper hidden behind the filler!

People told similar tales about all the Wimpey homes in Pitcorthie back in the 70s. Coming up for half a century and I've yet to see any of them collapse. They'll all have had upgrades over the years, though...except that one I viewed that looked like it did when it was first built in the 70s (including the sliding glass doors that definitely weren't meeting the modern safety standards!)

The one thing older properties have is character. I'd love to buy one, but not have the maintenance costs. To me they're like buying a classic car. They looks great and they've obviously lasted longer than most cars on the road, but you wouldn't want to rely on it getting you to work every day and it'll do about 12mpg!

Going back to the schools. One thing the ones being seen as "past it" have in common is being built during an experimental time. Some of the construction techniques were "interesting" and they're no doubt filled with that excellent fire retardant asbestos.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: JohnnyW  
Date:   Mon 2 Sep 22:10

Don't confuse lack of maintenance with poor build quality.

If owners and landlords refuse to partake in maintenance of the fabric of the building it doesn't matter how well built it is, given enough time it will show.



------------------------------------------------------------
Best tweet ever:



Post Edited (Mon 02 Sep 22:11)
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: oapar  
Date:   Tue 3 Sep 07:30

The real problems are now that some pupils are finding that some of the subjects they had chosen, and indeed had already started the course work for in June, are not available. This is the situation for the S6 pupils who joined St Columba's yesterday. Could jeopardise their whole future, as at this stage most will be studying the subjects needed for a place at university.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: ipswichpar  
Date:   Tue 3 Sep 07:57

This is awful. I'm assuming the restriction on subjects is due to teaching staff and/or facilities rather than materials?
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: DBP  
Date:   Tue 3 Sep 08:30

Quote:

oapar, Tue 3 Sep 07:30

The real problems are now that some pupils are finding that some of the subjects they had chosen, and indeed had already started the course work for in June, are not available. This is the situation for the S6 pupils who joined St Columba's yesterday. Could jeopardise their whole future, as at this stage most will be studying the subjects needed for a place at university.


Do you know what subjects, how many kids are impacted?

I imagine most schools follow broadly the same curriculum/subject choices, so if it's limited then could they run an evening class or have kids meet up for that subject somewhere.
My middle one used to go from Inverkeithing to the high school once a week
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: kelty_par  
Date:   Tue 3 Sep 08:43

That's exactly what I predicted further up the thread oapar. While most schools will follow broadly a similar structure, there was always going to be situations like this especially when many school have cut subjects, staff members etc. due to the crazy savings schools have been forced into making over the past few years. I know at my school we've had pupils from other schools coming along by taxi to do Highers and Advanced Highers and we've had some subjects not run this year due to a lack of staff or low pupil numbers. It totally flies in the face of the principle of "personalisation and choice" that Education Scotland say are key components of curriculum design.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: jake89  
Date:   Tue 3 Sep 08:52

I thought this may happen. When I was at school the same teacher for, say, Chemistry would teach S1-S6. This was possible as they stayed in the same room whilst we made our way to their class. This won't be possible if you have the year groups based across a variety of locations.

Honestly, whether the kid who did this meant to or not, he's affected the futures of a lot of lives with his act of stupidity.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: Playup_Pompey  
Date:   Tue 3 Sep 09:32

"we've had some subjects not run this year due to a lack of staff or low pupil numbers"

this is nothing new and indeed something we had issues with at the Old/New Queen anne 13/14 years ago. Lack of pupils selecting certain courses meant they werent run.

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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: oapar  
Date:   Tue 3 Sep 13:50

The point is PUP that the Woodmill students had started their chosen courses in June, it is because of the fire that they are now in this very unfortunate position.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: wee eck  
Date:   Fri 6 Sep 18:31

There will be a bucket collection before tomorrow's match to raise funds for the school.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: oapar  
Date:   Mon 9 Sep 19:24

A whole week in and some S6 pupils at St Columba's still have had no teaching and do not know if their chosen subjects will be covered. I feel so upset for all the hard work they have already put in and now they may not be able to sit the exams they need for their uni courses.

No matter what happens to the boy who started the fire it will never make up for the heartache and disappointment of these poor students.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: jake89  
Date:   Mon 9 Sep 21:55

I take it they're using online resources at least? Not ideal but better than them sitting around learning nothing.

I drove past a double length lorry this morning that I assume was headed to Woodmill. Hopefully if they're able to clear the damaged site they can start bringing in some huts.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: doctordandruff  
Date:   Tue 10 Sep 21:12

1st years up at Fordell Firs on Thursday as Vine is booked out.

One hope for the poor S5 and S6 is that I'm sure any exam results will factor in the circumstances they are having to study under

They are using online, but it just doesn't replace all the text books and resources that teachers have built up over their careers. I think the Rector admitted that in an ideal World it would be a month before the kids started.

Post Edited (Tue 10 Sep 21:13)
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: jake89  
Date:   Tue 10 Sep 21:42

Press saying 2 weeks of demolition before a deep clean is done. Apparently not as bad as first thought but it'll still need work done to corden parts of the building off and also bring in huts. A month sounds about right.
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 Re: Woodmill high
Topic Originator: Captain Desmond Fancey  
Date:   Wed 11 Sep 08:19

Drove past it yesterday and the demolition work has been rapid. Lots of council vans on the site too.

When viewing the damage in the immediate aftermath a timescale of a month would have seemed impossible.

The effort from everybody involved has been absolutely phenomenal.


The good old days
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