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 JK Rowling
Topic Originator: The One Who Knocks  
Date:   Thu 11 Jun 11:08

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-53002557

Never read any of her books or watched any of the Harry Potter films but I have always kind of admired Rowling for the way she just states her opinions and doesn't care. I suppose when you have her bank balance it certainly gives you the freedom to do so. She is certainly getting it in the neck for her views on this one though.

Edited to add; I don't know if she is right or wrong in her opinions. She doesn't seem to have made points that are all that controversial but I don't know enough about the matter to be confident about that.



Doubt is not a pleasant condition, but certainty is absurd

Post Edited (Thu 11 Jun 11:21)
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 Re: JK Rowling
Topic Originator: jake89  
Date:   Thu 11 Jun 12:33

It's been discussed on here before. Whilst there's respect for how people identify, it's very difficult to define people. Rowling has used menstruation to identify women who were born women (obviously not all women born as women can menstruate). I think this is as a result of not being able to use "men" and "women" in a binary fashion.
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 Re: JK Rowling
Topic Originator: Wotsit  
Date:   Thu 11 Jun 12:49

I think I agree with jake that the issue was with women who don't menstruate for whatever reason (including post-menopausal women) feeling as if JK Rowling was discounting them?

I'm a total leftie snowflake with a keen interest in how we use language to define people but I find the language around gender identity an absolute minefield like most folk my age. It's just not something that I have had to think about in any detail or with any seriousness until fairly recently.

The child who is not embraced by the village will burn it down to feel the warmth.
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 Re: JK Rowling
Topic Originator: The One Who Knocks  
Date:   Thu 11 Jun 16:53

Wasn't her initial umbrage with the headline or line in the articles that said 'people who menstrate'. I don't think she was being controversial in saying that only women can menstrate so why did the writer feel that they had to substitute the word women for people? Was the writer scared of being offensive in saying that only women can menstrate? Obviously that's not to say that all women can menstrate and that isn't a defining feature of being a woman I just think that while language is important sometimes it's more important to look at the intent behind the words and I don't think Rowling intended to offend people who already have a genuinely tough time.

Doubt is not a pleasant condition, but certainty is absurd
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 Re: JK Rowling
Topic Originator: jake89  
Date:   Thu 11 Jun 17:11

I believe there is a whole set of terminology that I am completely ignorant of but one of the terms used is "bleeder" to define women who were born women.

The whole gender thing creates confusion in a binary world. Can a trans person walk into any changing room, or only the type closest to the gender they identify as? Or is it the gender they were born as?

We have split changing rooms because obviously having shared ones may result in naughty behaviours. However, you could already have a woman in your changing room who is lesbian or bi. I suspect this is why there's been a move it unisex changing rooms and toilets.

The key thing is that everyone should be treated equally but we have rules and laws that aren't flexible in that way.
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 Re: JK Rowling
Topic Originator: sadindiefreak  
Date:   Thu 11 Jun 18:31

Quote:

The One Who Knocks, Thu 11 Jun 16:53

Wasn't her initial umbrage with the headline or line in the articles that said 'people who menstrate'. I don't think she was being controversial in saying that only women can menstrate so why did the writer feel that they had to substitute the word women for people? Was the writer scared of being offensive in saying that only women can menstrate? Obviously that's not to say that all women can menstrate and that isn't a defining feature of being a woman I just think that while language is important sometimes it's more important to look at the intent behind the words and I don't think Rowling intended to offend people who already have a genuinely tough time.


Trans men still menstrate.
Rowling definitely is trying to offend.
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 Re: JK Rowling
Topic Originator: The One Who Knocks  
Date:   Thu 11 Jun 18:37

And I thought I was on safe ground but their is one of those mines.

Doubt is not a pleasant condition, but certainty is absurd
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 Re: JK Rowling
Topic Originator: wee eck  
Date:   Thu 11 Jun 19:00

The word is 'menstruate'. That's my contribution to the debate.
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 Re: JK Rowling
Topic Originator: sadindiefreak  
Date:   Thu 11 Jun 19:47

Quote:

wee eck, Thu 11 Jun 19:00

The word is 'menstruate'. That's my contribution to the debate.


Thanks, where would we be without u.
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 Re: JK Rowling
Topic Originator: wee eck  
Date:   Thu 11 Jun 20:06

😊😊😊
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 Re: JK Rowling
Topic Originator: DulochConvert  
Date:   Thu 11 Jun 23:37

If this continues I am looking at Belarus 🇧🇾

Everyone has to feel guilty about something!!!!
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 Re: JK Rowling
Topic Originator: jake89  
Date:   Fri 12 Jun 00:48

Quote:

DulochConvert, Thu 11 Jun 23:37

If this continues I am looking at Belarus 🇧🇾

Everyone has to feel guilty about something!!!!


I'm offended that you've said Belarus rather than the Republic of Belarus. Can't believe you just said that to be honest. 😉
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 Re: JK Rowling
Topic Originator: doctordandruff  
Date:   Fri 12 Jun 16:16

We really are heading towards the first time in history where the next generation of people will be less tolerant and liberal than the preceding generation. I mean the reaction from the Harry Potter actors is astonishing. Why are they commenting now? The fact JK said she suffered domestic abuse has basically been ignored.Why are men telling a a woman she doesn't know what a woman is? It's simple, their publicists said 'Get a statement out now or they are coming for you next'
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 Re: JK Rowling
Topic Originator: londonparsfan  
Date:   Fri 12 Jun 16:22

No they didnt it's quite simply that they dont agree with what Rowling has said and want to distance themselves from her comments as leading parts of the franchise she wrote the books for.

They're perfectly entitled to their opinions and last time I checked Emma Watson wasn't a man.
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 Re: JK Rowling
Topic Originator: sadindiefreak  
Date:   Fri 12 Jun 16:30

Quote:

doctordandruff, Fri 12 Jun 16:16

We really are heading towards the first time in history where the next generation of people will be less tolerant and liberal than the preceding generation. I mean the reaction from the Harry Potter actors is astonishing. Why are they commenting now? The fact JK said she suffered domestic abuse has basically been ignored.Why are men telling a a woman she doesn't know what a woman is? It's simple, their publicists said 'Get a statement out now or they are coming for you next'


JK Rowling suffered domestic abuse at the hands of a man. Not a trans woman.
The fact she was assaulted by a man is irrelevant to her toxic views about Trans women.
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 Re: JK Rowling
Topic Originator: Westies squint kicks  
Date:   Fri 12 Jun 16:40

Im fed up with people being offended, period.
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 Re: JK Rowling
Topic Originator: londonparsfan  
Date:   Fri 12 Jun 16:48

So am I. It word be a far better world if we didn't have so many tw@s causing offense and people didn't have anything to be offended about.
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 Re: JK Rowling
Topic Originator: jake89  
Date:   Fri 12 Jun 16:59

Not sure what it has to do with any of the actors in Harry Potter. She wrote the books, not the film's. Those films stopped being made nearly a decade ago. I believe Radcliffe spoke as JK Rowling is linked with a charity he works with but all he's done is draw attention to her links!

Seems like everyone has to have their tuppence worth and everyone is getting their knickers in a twist over what seems like a minor issue. Perhaps if we just agreed that everyone is treated equally we'd be doing better?
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 Re: JK Rowling
Topic Originator: londonparsfan  
Date:   Fri 12 Jun 17:20

To be fair there's a pretty clear link between the books and the films - she had the rights to make the films and sold them to the production company and made a shed load off them. She also had specific requests around how the films were produced and has been involved enough in making the films that many of the cast seem to know her quite well.

Its understandable that the actors that front the franchise either get asked or comment on the creators view. They can either agree or disagree and it looks like most disagree.

Plenty of folk would disagree with you that Transgender rights are a minor issue but most would likely agree with the rest of the last sentence which is why JK Rowling is copping a bit of flack just now.
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 Re: JK Rowling
Topic Originator: doctordandruff  
Date:   Fri 12 Jun 17:38

That's the point I was making. This has heehaw to do with them. If it was important to them why didn't they make this point at any time in their past, or feel the need to reiterate it now. Other than the expectation that they were next.

Can someone actually explain why its transphobic. Has she got a specific issue with trans men, or is it more ability for any man to now access women's changing rooms etc

And the domestic abuse is very relevant as her main issue is the lack of safe space for women. But this cant be answered so she gets death threats instead. There is zero attempt at discussion.

Post Edited (Fri 12 Jun 17:54)
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 Re: JK Rowling
Topic Originator: londonparsfan  
Date:   Fri 12 Jun 18:05

Anyone can express a view on anything they want to. This isn't the first time she's made a bit of a fool of herself in this area and they cast have all been asked for their opinions on it in the past.

All of those names are heavily associated with Harry Potter and if they don't want to be associated with the creators views them they've got every right to voice their views and disassociate themselves with Rowling. They may well feel that if they don't disagree with Rowling then they could be viewed as giving their approval to Rowling's statements by doing nothing.

They've got every right to respond.
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 Re: JK Rowling
Topic Originator: DulochConvert  
Date:   Sat 13 Jun 05:13

The life of Brian coliseum scene springs to mind! We will fight them for your rights to have babes, brother/ sister!
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 Re: JK Rowling
Topic Originator: londonparsfan  
Date:   Sat 13 Jun 07:55

That is a classic!
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