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 I beg to differ
Topic Originator: Parboiled  
Date:   Sat 30 Sep 10:48

Choosing Humza over Kate Forbes is the SNP’s biggest ever mistake says Fergus Ewing.
Depends on how you look at it. Perfect, just perfect!

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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: Tenruh  
Date:   Sun 1 Oct 07:31

Quote:

Parboiled, Sat 30 Sept 10:48

Choosing Humza over Kate Forbes is the SNP’s biggest ever mistake says Fergus Ewing.
Depends on how you look at it. Perfect, just perfect!


Preferred Ash Regan over both of the continuity candidates, strangly all our local councillors voted for Humza, wonder why that was ?
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: jake89  
Date:   Sun 1 Oct 09:01

Ash Reagan? 😂

She seemed good until probed for answers. She would then just crumble and turn into Vicky Pollard.
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: Tenruh  
Date:   Mon 2 Oct 19:40

Quote:

jake89, Sun 1 Oct 09:01

Ash Reagan? 😂

She seemed good until probed for answers. She would then just crumble and turn into Vicky Pollard.


She was certainly disadvantaged. The nuSNP leadership decided to reduce the contest from 4 months to 4 weeks. Any idea why ?
Did you know the morning before the selection process closed all Fife Councillors come out in favour of the continuity candidate , you`d wonder why...anyway our own MSP also voted for continuity.
Will be interesting to see how this weeks by election goes for the Green/nuSNP coalition.

https://fb.watch/nqN2CJUm6Z/?startTimeMs=1040
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: jake89  
Date:   Mon 2 Oct 22:53

Regan didn`t come across well at all. I`d say Humza Yousaf is a good speaker, not a great one. Regan came across as severely lacking in confidence and, at time, completely out of her depth. I see now she also accepted an interview with GB News to discuss her views on Gender Reform. Each to their own, but there`s a good reason GB News is losing advertisers and having to suspend/sack so many of their "interviewers".
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: Tenruh  
Date:   Tue 3 Oct 05:39

Quote:

jake89, Mon 2 Oct 22:53

Regan didn`t come across well at all. I`d say Humza Yousaf is a good speaker, not a great one. Regan came across as severely lacking in confidence and, at time, completely out of her depth. I see now she also accepted an interview with GB News to discuss her views on Gender Reform. Each to their own, but there`s a good reason GB News is losing advertisers and having to suspend/sack so many of their "interviewers".


Don`t understand what the connection with Regan and GB news is ,no one is denying her nervousness early in the campaign. She did get better as time went on and if it had been a fair run competition ie over the recognised longer period she would have closed the gap.
Of course everything was arranged to benefit the "continuity " candidate, the private educated school boy who started his working life in Holywood as a spad to his uncle.
Well we`ll find out soon how good continuity will be for the wage earners in the nuSNP. whether they still have the 70,000 members or not to prop them up.
To think back to September 2014 , who would have thought BLiS would be looking to win back around 50% of the Westminster seats and go into coalition with the nuSNP in Holyrood?
Where has it all gone wrong ?

Post Edited (Tue 03 Oct 06:35)
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: jake89  
Date:   Tue 3 Oct 07:14

GB News is probably the worst excuse for a broadcaster in the UK and she proudly went on to discuss the single issue she felt was most important to her supporters - opposing gender reform. She incorrectly suggested the gender reform bill would allow me identifying as women into female prisons. That decision is and would continue to be made by a panel within the Scottish Prison Service, as was the case with Isla Bryson. Either she knew this and highlighted it stoke things up, or didn`t and is not well informed. Based on her other interviews and statements, I worry that it`s the latter.

Of course, I`d say none of the candidates were particularly inspiring.

Edited to ask: Was Ahmad HY's actual uncle? I can't find anything to suggest he was other than a reference to HJ referring to him as such when he passed away. It's pretty common for people of Muslim faith to use uncle/auntie for older people they are close to and respect.

Post Edited (Tue 03 Oct 23:07)
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: Andrew283  
Date:   Tue 3 Oct 09:19

Going on GB News killed any small chance she`s win popularity with the mostly left leaning youth vote, especially with her views.
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: The One Who Knocks  
Date:   Tue 3 Oct 09:29

Ash Regan would have stood a better chance if many of her supporters hadn`t chucked their toys out of the pram and went and joined Alba.
You don`t have to look back as far as 2014 Tenruh. In 2015 the Sturgeon led SNP won all but three seats in the Westminster election.

And although my eyes were open
They just might as well be closed
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: Tenruh  
Date:   Tue 3 Oct 17:22

Quote:

The One Who Knocks, Tue 3 Oct 09:29

Ash Regan would have stood a better chance if many of her supporters hadn`t chucked their toys out of the pram and went and joined Alba.
You don`t have to look back as far as 2014 Tenruh. In 2015 the Sturgeon led SNP won all but three seats in the Westminster election.


She could have won every one and it changes nothing.
BTW a monkey in charge of the SNP in 2015 would have won the lot.
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: Tenruh  
Date:   Tue 3 Oct 17:36

Quote:

Andrew283, Tue 3 Oct 09:19

Going on GB News killed any small chance she`s win popularity with the mostly left leaning youth vote, especially with her views.


You`ll never please everyone, but I`m sure she`ll have the backing of most adult females.
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: wee eck  
Date:   Tue 3 Oct 17:37

You still haven`t told us what the route to independence is - or did I miss that?
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: Tenruh  
Date:   Tue 3 Oct 17:43

Quote:

jake89, Tue 3 Oct 07:14

GB News is probably the worst excuse for a broadcaster in the UK and she proudly went on to discuss the single issue she felt was most important to her supporters - opposing gender reform. She incorrectly suggested the gender reform bill would allow me identifying as women into female prisons. That decision is and would continue to be made by a panel within the Scottish Prison Service, as was the case with Isla Burton. Either she knew this and highlighted it stoke things up, or didn`t and is not well informed. Based on her other interviews and statements, I worry that it`s the latter.

Of course, I`d say none of the candidates were particularly inspiring.

Edited to ask: Was Ahmad HY`s actual uncle? I can`t find anything to suggest he was other than a reference to HJ referring to him as such when he passed away. It`s pretty common for people of Muslim faith to use uncle/auntie for older people they are close to and respect.


Couldn`t find an Isla Burton . I found an Isla Bryson , a double rapist who was on his way to a Woman's prison and Nicola Sturgeon pulled the plug on the transfer and when asked to define an adult female unbelievably she couldn't. Think that may have been her downfall.

Maybe it wasn`t his uncle but why does it matter ? He`s never had a job outside politics .

https://youtu.be/zpMDkGQ57yQ?si=Pa71Vw3YCZT6t-Jb

Post Edited (Tue 03 Oct 17:51)
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: jake89  
Date:   Tue 3 Oct 20:00

Quote:

Tenruh, Tue 3 Oct 17:43

Quote:

jake89, Tue 3 Oct 07:14

GB News is probably the worst excuse for a broadcaster in the UK and she proudly went on to discuss the single issue she felt was most important to her supporters - opposing gender reform. She incorrectly suggested the gender reform bill would allow me identifying as women into female prisons. That decision is and would continue to be made by a panel within the Scottish Prison Service, as was the case with Isla Burton. Either she knew this and highlighted it stoke things up, or didn`t and is not well informed. Based on her other interviews and statements, I worry that it`s the latter.

Of course, I`d say none of the candidates were particularly inspiring.

Edited to ask: Was Ahmad HY`s actual uncle? I can`t find anything to suggest he was other than a reference to HJ referring to him as such when he passed away. It`s pretty common for people of Muslim faith to use uncle/auntie for older people they are close to and respect.


Couldn`t find an Isla Burton . I found an Isla Bryson , a double rapist who was on his way to a Woman`s prison and Nicola Sturgeon pulled the plug on the transfer and when asked to define an adult female unbelievably she couldn`t. Think that may have been her downfall.

Maybe it wasn`t his uncle but why does it matter ? He`s never had a job outside politics .

https://youtu.be/zpMDkGQ57yQ?si=Pa71Vw3YCZT6t-Jb


Sorry, got the name wrong.

However, you`ve regurgitated what the likes of Regan said. This is NOT true, and this was decided WITHOUT the GRA.

When there is a trans person admitted they are held separately whilst an assessment by SPS takes place. Only then are they admitted to a prison. The Isla Bryson case was made a big deal of as she was assessed in a woman`s prison but this isn`t anything new and is irrelevant as they were never in with the general population.

Ash Regan knew this. The media knew this. Unfortunately, "standard procedure followed" doesn`t win votes or sell papers.

Re: Uncle - it was you who highlighted it clearly mattered to you.

I'm also wondering what attending a grammar school has to do with anything.

Post Edited (Tue 03 Oct 20:03)
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: Wotsit  
Date:   Wed 4 Oct 13:33

Presumably she was asked to describe an adult human female (more commonly known as "a woman") rather than just "an adult female?"

If so, I can see why that might be difficult in a society were there is confusion around the difference between gender (a social construct which seems to be a particularly human concept that is rather fuzzy) and sex (a biological distinction which exists across all species of animal and some plants.)

It`s really easy to describe the female sex (using genetics for example), but it is less easy, really difficult in fact, to describe the female gender.


"Who you are and what you feel comes not just from inside you, but from where you are in the power structure"
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: Parboiled  
Date:   Wed 4 Oct 14:34

I note that trans men and non binary people with a cervix who were assigned female at birth and are registered as such with their GP will be invited for cervical cancer screening.
There is not yet a screening programme for prostate cancer so trans women and non binary people assigned male at birth with a prostate need to watch out for piddle problems and raise it with their GP
And the Moon is made of Cheddar cheese



Post Edited (Wed 04 Oct 14:35)
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: Dave_1885  
Date:   Wed 4 Oct 15:35

Quote:

Parboiled, Wed 4 Oct 14:34

I note that trans men and non binary people with a cervix who were assigned female at birth and are registered as such with their GP will be invited for cervical cancer screening.
There is not yet a screening programme for prostate cancer so trans women and non binary people assigned male at birth with a prostate need to watch out for piddle problems and raise it with their GP
And the Moon is made of Cheddar cheese


Thats not even slightly surprising since biology trumps psychology…..

The fact you still manage to get some random tosh about the moon and cheese in there just sums you up as a person…
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: jake89  
Date:   Wed 4 Oct 17:34

Quote:

Parboiled, Wed 4 Oct 14:34

I note that trans men and non binary people with a cervix who were assigned female at birth and are registered as such with their GP will be invited for cervical cancer screening.
There is not yet a screening programme for prostate cancer so trans women and non binary people assigned male at birth with a prostate need to watch out for piddle problems and raise it with their GP
And the Moon is made of Cheddar cheese



Even a woman with part of a cervix (someone who may have had a hysterectomy) gets invited when they reach a certain age as they`re still at risk of cervical cancer.

There isn`t an official screening programme for prostate cancer but men (or people born as male) can request a screening when they reach a certain age, or if they have concerns.

In my view, the simple thing would be to work on the basis of sex, rather than gender, though it should be noted that there are also a small number of intersex people.
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: Tenruh  
Date:   Wed 4 Oct 17:57

Quote:

wee eck, Tue 3 Oct 17:37

You still haven`t told us what the route to independence is - or did I miss that?


Don`t know if the question is asked to me, if after 9 years and 90+ nuSNP members of both parliaments earning as much as £200,000 each year cannot answer your question how do you think I can?
Would like to be on the gravy train though.

Oh just a quick observation, the nuSNP must have thought they had the answer to the question as we were having a further referendum 2 weeks tomorrow.
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: wee eck  
Date:   Wed 4 Oct 18:14

The answer to the question is that, under the present arrangements, there is no democratic route to independence which does not require the consent of a Unionist party. It`s like playing cards with a dealer who has the cards stacked in his favour.

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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: Tenruh  
Date:   Wed 4 Oct 19:00

Quote:

wee eck, Wed 4 Oct 18:14

The answer to the question is that, under the present arrangements, there is no democratic route to independence which does not require the consent of a Unionist party. It`s like playing cards with a dealer who has the cards stacked in his favour.


Why do the nuSNP consistently promise us independence prior to an election then nothing until the next election ?

Why not be honest with the electorate and just say we`re loving being a devolutionist party with all the benefits that come with that.

What happened to the 19/10/23 referendum that Sturgeon promised us?
How much groundwork went into her thinking because she and her party had 9 yrs to plan it.
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: AdamAntsParsStripe  
Date:   Wed 4 Oct 19:16

Quote:

Tenruh, Wed 4 Oct 19:00

Quote:

wee eck, Wed 4 Oct 18:14

The answer to the question is that, under the present arrangements, there is no democratic route to independence which does not require the consent of a Unionist party. It`s like playing cards with a dealer who has the cards stacked in his favour.


Why do the nuSNP consistently promise us independence prior to an election then nothing until the next election ?

Why not be honest with the electorate and just say we`re loving being a devolutionist party with all the benefits that come with that.

What happened to the 19/10/23 referendum that Sturgeon promised us?
How much groundwork went into her thinking because she and her party had 9 yrs to plan it.


How do they get a referendum if they get told no time and time again?

Zwei Pints Bier und ein Päckchen Chips bitte
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: wee eck  
Date:   Wed 4 Oct 19:47

Tenruh, the Unionists just love independence supporters like you, directing their ire at the SNP instead of the real opposition. As has been said on here before it`s a classic establishment tactic - divide and rule.
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: jake89  
Date:   Wed 4 Oct 20:09

If there`s no route to independence and this can be officially said by Westminster then it`s one to go international on. That would essentially be holding a nation against its will.
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: Tenruh  
Date:   Wed 4 Oct 20:27

Quote:

AdamAntsParsStripe, Wed 4 Oct 19:16

Quote:

Tenruh, Wed 4 Oct 19:00

Quote:

wee eck, Wed 4 Oct 18:14

The answer to the question is that, under the present arrangements, there is no democratic route to independence which does not require the consent of a Unionist party. It`s like playing cards with a dealer who has the cards stacked in his favour.


Why do the nuSNP consistently promise us independence prior to an election then nothing until the next election ?

Why not be honest with the electorate and just say we`re loving being a devolutionist party with all the benefits that come with that.

What happened to the 19/10/23 referendum that Sturgeon promised us?
How much groundwork went into her thinking because she and her party had 9 yrs to plan it.


How do they get a referendum if they get told no time and time again?


Why did Sturgeon promise one on 19th October? What groundwork was done to facilitate it?
Have they been lying to the electorate constantly promising a referendum?
What actually have our MPs been doing the last 9 years?
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: Tenruh  
Date:   Wed 4 Oct 20:32

Quote:

jake89, Wed 4 Oct 20:09

If there`s no route to independence and this can be officially said by Westminster then it`s one to go international on. That would essentially be holding a nation against its will.


Exactly, what the English Supreme Court decided last December the SNP could have found out 8 years ago and built a case around that decision.

What have our MPs been doing other than slurping at the trough since 2014.

The Independence movement have been split by the politicians we have put our faith in.
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: Tenruh  
Date:   Wed 4 Oct 20:41

Quote:

wee eck, Wed 4 Oct 19:47

Tenruh, the Unionists just love independence supporters like you, directing their ire at the SNP instead of the real opposition. As has been said on here before it`s a classic establishment tactic - divide and rule.


The nuSNP are the opposition , they`ve had the responsibility to drive independence the last 16 years and have sat on their shirt tails achieving zilch but getting bumper wages and pensions.
If I had the power no independence politician would get more than one session in the devolved parliament.
We`ve been stiched up with this kid-on Scottish devolved Parliament, look how the English have completely split the Independence Movement.
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: wee eck  
Date:   Wed 4 Oct 22:13

So we`ve got two conspiracy theories; one involving `the English` setting up the Scottish Parliament and the other one implicating every MP and MSP who has represented the SNP since then. Presumably the only ones not implicated are the two who got elected as SNP MPs then betrayed their constituents by switching to another party.
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: Tenruh  
Date:   Thu 5 Oct 04:39

Quote:

wee eck, Wed 4 Oct 22:13

So we`ve got two conspiracy theories; one involving `the English` setting up the Scottish Parliament and the other one implicating every MP and MSP who has represented the SNP since then. Presumably the only ones not implicated are the two who got elected as SNP MPs then betrayed their constituents by switching to another party.



You've forgotten Margaret Ferrier, the MP who the party campaigned to get booted out of the English Parliament and today they'll reap what they sewed.

Bye bye nuSNP , another seat lost to mismanagement and infiltration.

Post Edited (Thu 05 Oct 04:48)
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: Parboiled  
Date:   Thu 5 Oct 07:04

“reap what they sewed”

Darn right they will!

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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: wee eck  
Date:   Thu 5 Oct 07:40

So the plot thickens; Margaret Ferrier`s demise was engineered by the SNP. Did they force her to break the COVID rules?

I see the general secretary of Alba has reported Rishi Sunak to Police Scotland for contempt of court arising from his comments about Nicola Sturgeon at the Tory conference yesterday. I`m not clear why he has chosen to do that. Many such comments have been made by politicians up here with no consequences.
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: The One Who Knocks  
Date:   Thu 5 Oct 08:33

See I`m torn now. I was wanting the snp to lose today as I think their record warrants them getting an electoral kicking (and not just today) but reading Tenruh`s posts has me thinking twice.

And although my eyes were open
They just might as well be closed
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: Parboiled  
Date:   Thu 5 Oct 09:55

Sticking to your guns not..fat lot of use you would have been at the Alamo!

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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: buffy  
Date:   Thu 5 Oct 15:11

Wee Eck, it’s because it’s an ongoing investigation and any remarks made which may affect future proceedings have to be reported on. Sunak would have known this beforehand but, like everything else which dribbles from his Tory tongue, he’ll say it anyway.

”Buffy’s Buns are the finest in Fife”, J. Spence 2019”
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: wee eck  
Date:   Thu 5 Oct 15:44

I know that`s the legal position, Buffy. What I was querying was why similar comments made by politicians in Scotland have not been reported. Opposition parties often use the police investigation to cast aspersions on the SNP when no charges have been made.
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: Tenruh  
Date:   Thu 5 Oct 17:53

Quote:

wee eck, Thu 5 Oct 07:40

So the plot thickens; Margaret Ferrier`s demise was engineered by the SNP. Did they force her to break the COVID rules?

I see the general secretary of Alba has reported Rishi Sunak to Police Scotland for contempt of court arising from his comments about Nicola Sturgeon at the Tory conference yesterday. I`m not clear why he has chosen to do that. Many such comments have been made by politicians up here with no consequences.


The SNP asked their members to support the recall petition. to effectively get Ferrier sacked.

I must add Margaret Ferrier was the hardest working MP, she would turn up to support all by-elections whether it was in Dumfries or Wick...everyone...Sturgeon never once turned up at a AUOB march in Glasgow .
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: Tenruh  
Date:   Thu 5 Oct 17:56

Quote:

The One Who Knocks, Thu 5 Oct 08:33

See I`m torn now. I was wanting the snp to lose today as I think their record warrants them getting an electoral kicking (and not just today) but reading Tenruh`s posts has me thinking twice.


Doesn`t matter if you`re torn or not, what will be will be.

Hopefully a nuSNP trouncing.

Get them out of Holyrood also and we start again
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: wee eck  
Date:   Thu 5 Oct 18:25

I`m surprised you`ve got time to post today. I thought you`d be at Rutherglen and Hamilton West helping Labour to get their vote out.

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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: Tenruh  
Date:   Thu 5 Oct 19:59

Quote:

wee eck, Thu 5 Oct 18:25

I`m surprised you`ve got time to post today. I thought you`d be at Rutherglen and Hamilton West helping Labour to get their vote out.


Your part right, I`ve actually seen leafletting for the lSP a true Independence party.
You should have a look at their website, no troughers allowed.

How do you think our devolution party will do against BliS ?

Not sure how the result will go as Independence is still sitting at 50% but nuSNP are not setting the heather on fire with their coalition with the Greens. Some odd reason makes me think they`re losing the female vote
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: wee eck  
Date:   Thu 5 Oct 20:05

I have no idea how the result will go but no doubt all the main parties will manage to interpret it as some kind of success.
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: Dave_1885  
Date:   Thu 5 Oct 21:47

Quote:

Tenruh, Thu 5 Oct 17:56

Quote:

The One Who Knocks, Thu 5 Oct 08:33

See I`m torn now. I was wanting the snp to lose today as I think their record warrants them getting an electoral kicking (and not just today) but reading Tenruh`s posts has me thinking twice.


Doesn`t matter if you`re torn or not, what will be will be.

Hopefully a nuSNP trouncing.

Get them out of Holyrood also and we start again


Get them out and replace them with a Labour/Tory coalition! Thats 100% the right way to getting IndyRef2 through 👍🏻
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: jake89  
Date:   Thu 5 Oct 22:15

Quote:

Dave_1885, Thu 5 Oct 21:47

Quote:

Tenruh, Thu 5 Oct 17:56

Quote:

The One Who Knocks, Thu 5 Oct 08:33

See I`m torn now. I was wanting the snp to lose today as I think their record warrants them getting an electoral kicking (and not just today) but reading Tenruh`s posts has me thinking twice.


Doesn`t matter if you`re torn or not, what will be will be.

Hopefully a nuSNP trouncing.

Get them out of Holyrood also and we start again


Get them out and replace them with a Labour/Tory coalition! Thats 100% the right way to getting IndyRef2 through 👍🏻


No, but, yeah, but, no...because Alba...
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: Tenruh  
Date:   Fri 6 Oct 05:04

Quote:

jake89, Thu 5 Oct 22:15

Quote:

Dave_1885, Thu 5 Oct 21:47

Quote:

Tenruh, Thu 5 Oct 17:56

Quote:

The One Who Knocks, Thu 5 Oct 08:33

See I`m torn now. I was wanting the snp to lose today as I think their record warrants them getting an electoral kicking (and not just today) but reading Tenruh`s posts has me thinking twice.


Doesn`t matter if you`re torn or not, what will be will be.

Hopefully a nuSNP trouncing.

Get them out of Holyrood also and we start again


Get them out and replace them with a Labour/Tory coalition! Thats 100% the right way to getting IndyRef2 through 👍🏻


No, but, yeah, but, no...because Alba...


Ha ha, Sturgeon has done a right one, right enough, not just destroyed a party which had 126,000 members 3 years ago (allegedly) but also destroyed the Independence movement as well. Ach don`t worry we`ve got the continuity FM to make it all better.

Re the BLiS/Tory coalition you may be right, but I suspect in will probably be BLiS/nuSNP with the Scottish devolution party the lesser partner, remember the Daily Records "Vow" well the architect of that has replace Pete Murrell as the nuSNP Chef Executive.
You couldn`t make it up could you?

Jake, I'm so happy this morning and plenty more fun ahead.

Post Edited (Fri 06 Oct 05:09)
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: DBP  
Date:   Fri 6 Oct 06:25

Quote:


Jake, I`m so happy this morning and plenty more fun ahead.


I suppose all unionists will be!

They’ll argue that given the only credible vote for Indy is the SNP, this single result will be used to underpin the narrative that nobody wants Indy anymore, and conversely, the union is the strongest it’s ever been
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: The One Who Knocks  
Date:   Fri 6 Oct 07:22

It`ll be a Labour minority administration at Holyrood after the next election for Holyrood and I suspect that, with Labour holding a commanding majority in Westminster by then, that Scottish Labour will be able to rinse a bit extra in funding out of Westminster for Scotland. Change is good.



Post Edited (Fri 06 Oct 07:24)
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: Dave_1885  
Date:   Fri 6 Oct 07:40

Imagine being an advocate for Indy then being delighted the only party that MIGHT get an Indy ref in our lifetime losing a seat in a crucial by-election 🤦🏻‍♂️ couldn’t make it up!
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: jake89  
Date:   Fri 6 Oct 08:13

My concern with Labour is what SLab say often contradicts what UKLab say. Whilst this doesn`t matter as Holyrood level, it matters at UK level where Scotland could very much aid an out the pan, into the fire situation at the next UK GE.

I`ll never vote Tory but I`d struggle to vote for UKLabour at this time. However, who is the alternative?!

Also find it bizarre that anyone wanting independence would be happy with Labour winning anything. The SNP have failed, but they`re still the only credible independence option. You certainly won`t get independence under Labour!
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: wee eck  
Date:   Fri 6 Oct 08:32

By-elections always give the voters a chance to give the incumbent a kicking and the circumstances which gave rise to this one just added to that. At a general election the situation is different. If support for independence is still at 45 to 50 pc who does an independence supporter vote for at a general election?

I see the Tories are taking comfort from the fact they beat the Greens!
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: Tenruh  
Date:   Fri 6 Oct 08:49

The nuSNP are traitors to Scotland and have made it clear to their members that devolution is all they are interested in. You lot have been got at if you think otherwise.
Since Sturgeon took over its been one disaster after another, she has devided the independence movement and then ran off. Why the sudden rush to leave office ?
Please tell me what the SNP have achieved in the last 9 years that has fundamentally benefited the population.
You do understand why they got a kicking last night ?
Bet you don`t. Well believe me independence has been set back at least 15 years.
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: Andrew283  
Date:   Fri 6 Oct 09:20

Quote:

Tenruh, Fri 6 Oct 08:49

The nuSNP are traitors to Scotland and have made it clear to their members that devolution is all they are interested in. You lot have been got at if you think otherwise.
Since Sturgeon took over its been one disaster after another, she has devided the independence movement and then ran off. Why the sudden rush to leave office ?
Please tell me what the SNP have achieved in the last 9 years that has fundamentally benefited the population.
You do understand why they got a kicking last night ?
Bet you don`t. Well believe me independence has been set back at least 15 years.


Jesus you sound like a broken record. What is with political lunatics and bizarre catch phrases? NuSNP? Massive cringe
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: Tenruh  
Date:   Fri 6 Oct 09:30

Quote:

Andrew283, Fri 6 Oct 09:20

Quote:

Tenruh, Fri 6 Oct 08:49

The nuSNP are traitors to Scotland and have made it clear to their members that devolution is all they are interested in. You lot have been got at if you think otherwise.
Since Sturgeon took over its been one disaster after another, she has devided the independence movement and then ran off. Why the sudden rush to leave office ?
Please tell me what the SNP have achieved in the last 9 years that has fundamentally benefited the population.
You do understand why they got a kicking last night ?
Bet you don`t. Well believe me independence has been set back at least 15 years.


Jesus you sound like a broken record. What is with political lunatics and bizarre catch phrases? NuSNP? Massive cringe


Andy just yer usual, no answer to my questions?
Come on tell me why nuSNP are your favourites....
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: Parboiled  
Date:   Fri 6 Oct 09:35

Cause he’s nuMB from the neck up

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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: Andrew283  
Date:   Fri 6 Oct 09:38

Quote:

Tenruh, Fri 6 Oct 09:30

Quote:

Andrew283, Fri 6 Oct 09:20

Quote:

Tenruh, Fri 6 Oct 08:49

The nuSNP are traitors to Scotland and have made it clear to their members that devolution is all they are interested in. You lot have been got at if you think otherwise.
Since Sturgeon took over its been one disaster after another, she has devided the independence movement and then ran off. Why the sudden rush to leave office ?
Please tell me what the SNP have achieved in the last 9 years that has fundamentally benefited the population.
You do understand why they got a kicking last night ?
Bet you don`t. Well believe me independence has been set back at least 15 years.


Jesus you sound like a broken record. What is with political lunatics and bizarre catch phrases? NuSNP? Massive cringe


Andy just yer usual, no answer to my questions?
Come on tell me why nuSNP are your favourites....


You haven`t been able to give a single answer to how to achieve indy when questioned multiple times on it, so it`s ironic you`re bringing not answering questions...

To answer you however, they aren`t my favourite, but I`d take the SNP over any of the sub-parties from Westminster.
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: Tenruh  
Date:   Fri 6 Oct 10:09

Quote:

Andrew283, Fri 6 Oct 09:38

Quote:

Tenruh, Fri 6 Oct 09:30

Quote:

Andrew283, Fri 6 Oct 09:20

Quote:

Tenruh, Fri 6 Oct 08:49

The nuSNP are traitors to Scotland and have made it clear to their members that devolution is all they are interested in. You lot have been got at if you think otherwise.
Since Sturgeon took over its been one disaster after another, she has devided the independence movement and then ran off. Why the sudden rush to leave office ?
Please tell me what the SNP have achieved in the last 9 years that has fundamentally benefited the population.
You do understand why they got a kicking last night ?
Bet you don`t. Well believe me independence has been set back at least 15 years.


Jesus you sound like a broken record. What is with political lunatics and bizarre catch phrases? NuSNP? Massive cringe


Andy just yer usual, no answer to my questions?
Come on tell me why nuSNP are your favourites....


You haven`t been able to give a single answer to how to achieve indy when questioned multiple times on it, so it`s ironic you`re bringing not answering questions...

To answer you however, they aren`t my favourite, but I`d take the SNP over any of the sub-parties from Westminster.


Why do you think I should have the ability to answer how Scotland can achieve Independence?

One of my issues is why are all the big wage earners not finding the solution to Independence? They promise before an election Independence, then when elected go quiet on the subject.

Roll-on a week on Thursday when we get our Indy2 referendum wee Nic promised.
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: wee eck  
Date:   Fri 6 Oct 10:26

Tenruh, you`re totally lacking in self-awareness. You imply that the road to independence is relatively straightforward and then admit it`s far too difficult for you to fathom.

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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: Andrew283  
Date:   Fri 6 Oct 10:28

Quote:

wee eck, Fri 6 Oct 10:26

Tenruh, you`re totally lacking in self-awareness. You imply that the road to independence is relatively straightforward and then admit it`s far too difficult for you to fathom.


Guy is an absolute 🤡🤡
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: Tenruh  
Date:   Fri 6 Oct 10:34

Quote:

wee eck, Fri 6 Oct 10:26

Tenruh, you`re totally lacking in self-awareness. You imply that the road to independence is relatively straightforward and then admit it`s far too difficult for you to fathom.


Where have I said the road to Independence is straightforward? And to difficult to fathom ?
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: Tenruh  
Date:   Fri 6 Oct 10:35

Quote:

Andrew283, Fri 6 Oct 10:28

Quote:

wee eck, Fri 6 Oct 10:26

Tenruh, you`re totally lacking in self-awareness. You imply that the road to independence is relatively straightforward and then admit it`s far too difficult for you to fathom.


Guy is an absolute 🤡🤡


Andy what are you here for ? The clowns are the nuSNP troughers.
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: Andrew283  
Date:   Fri 6 Oct 10:56

Quote:

Tenruh, Fri 6 Oct 10:35

Quote:

Andrew283, Fri 6 Oct 10:28

Quote:

wee eck, Fri 6 Oct 10:26

Tenruh, you`re totally lacking in self-awareness. You imply that the road to independence is relatively straightforward and then admit it`s far too difficult for you to fathom.


Guy is an absolute 🤡🤡


Andy what are you here for ? The clowns are the nuSNP troughers.


My name is actually Andrew, as clearly shown. I know your desire to nickname everything you don`t agree with but that should be a simple thing 🙄
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: jake89  
Date:   Fri 6 Oct 11:15

Isn`t this a case of cutting off your nose to spite your face?

The SNP have been pretty hopeless at pushing forward the independence agenda. Admittedly, there appears to be no route to independence available. Once you accept this you realise THIS is what the SNP should be focussed on in terms of the move towards independence. Why aren`t they hammering Westminster and international courts about it?

What I`d say, though, is that voting Labour (or any other unionist) party is counter-productive. It`s not so much a warning **** across the bow but a complete sinking of the independence ship. If Scotland were to have a majority of Labour MPs in Westminster and Holyrood then we`d see immediate steps taken to kill any opportunity to progress towards independence. At least with the SNP they can pretend to want it.

The only other credible option would be Alba and they still come across as a bit tinpot IMO. Of course, so did the SNP until recently.
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: wee eck  
Date:   Fri 6 Oct 11:27

Imagine being a Pars fan who was so disillusioned with the way the club was being run that you`d support Falkirk to beat us if you thought that would achieve a change in control.

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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: Tenruh  
Date:   Fri 6 Oct 11:36

Quote:

jake89, Fri 6 Oct 11:15

Isn`t this a case of cutting off your nose to spite your face?

The SNP have been pretty hopeless at pushing forward the independence agenda. Admittedly, there appears to be no route to independence available. Once you accept this you realise THIS is what the SNP should be focussed on in terms of the move towards independence. Why aren`t they hammering Westminster and international courts about it?

What I`d say, though, is that voting Labour (or any other unionist) party is counter-productive. It`s not so much a warning **** across the bow but a complete sinking of the independence ship. If Scotland were to have a majority of Labour MPs in Westminster and Holyrood then we`d see immediate steps taken to kill any opportunity to progress towards independence. At least with the SNP they can pretend to want it.

The only other credible option would be Alba and they still come across as a bit tinpot IMO. Of course, so did the SNP until recently.


Alba are not an option because half the electorate will not accept him. Sturgeon has done a good one on him and anyone else who crossed her path.
My dislike of the SNP is basically two fold.

1, the removal of all the power`s the grassroots membership that the party enjoyed until Sturgeon took over.

2, a clique who thought they were above the law in trying to jail an innocent individual.

I cannot speak on anyone else`s part, but seeing elected members who have watched this behaviour and kept quiet , what does that say about them ?

If a devolved government thinks it`s acceptable to try and jail an innocent individual ( and get away with it)what do you think they would do if Scotland was Independent ?
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: Tenruh  
Date:   Fri 6 Oct 11:39

Quote:

Andrew283, Fri 6 Oct 10:56

Quote:

Tenruh, Fri 6 Oct 10:35

Quote:

Andrew283, Fri 6 Oct 10:28

Quote:

wee eck, Fri 6 Oct 10:26

Tenruh, you`re totally lacking in self-awareness. You imply that the road to independence is relatively straightforward and then admit it`s far too difficult for you to fathom.


Guy is an absolute 🤡🤡


Andy what are you here for ? The clowns are the nuSNP troughers.


My name is actually Andrew, as clearly shown. I know your desire to nickname everything you don`t agree with but that should be a simple thing 🙄


Says the man who puts up the clown emojos
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: The One Who Knocks  
Date:   Fri 6 Oct 12:55

Jake you say that voting for Labour or any other unionist party is cutting your nose off to spite your face but so is voting SNP now in my opinion. I`m not against independence, voted yes time and likely would again, but I also want competent governance in the meantime. The snp have been woeful these past few years and have taken the electorate for granted and, like Labour for the last decade, there is a price to pay for that.
Despite Salmond`s , and I`ll be generous here, numerous personal flaws and failings, he at least led a Holyrood administration that seemed to get things done. Now that may have been because they were new to power and had points to prove and seats that weren`t seemingly secure but to me that just proves that what can be achieved when politicians fear what the next election holds.

And although my eyes were open
They just might as well be closed
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: wee eck  
Date:   Fri 6 Oct 13:05

The paradox of Scottish politics :-

Support for Scottish independence leads by four points

Support for Scottish independence still remains strong despite the drop in support for the SNP, according new findings released by the Tony Blair Institute.

Polling carried out by the institute found that 45% of respondents would vote yes in a new independence referendum, compared to 41% who would vote no, a four-point lead for independence.

Despite this, the issue of independence is not the priority issue for voters in Scotland ahead of the next general election. A third of SNP voters polled said that defeating the Conservatives is their priority. The report found that Scottish voters say the top priority for the next government should be improving the NHS, followed by delivering better schools and faster economic growth. Few Scottish Conservative voters said cutting taxes is a priority.

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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: jake89  
Date:   Fri 6 Oct 13:52

Tenruh, assume "him" = Salmond? No view on him but the issue with Alba is unrelated to him and more to do with them being a new party with only a small number of candidates.

TOWK, completely agree but my point is that voting Labour DEFINITELY won`t lead to independence and I expect would make it even harder should a more active independence party such as Alba start to gain in popularity.
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: Dave_1885  
Date:   Fri 6 Oct 14:00

I think we all just need to accept that Tenruh and Parboiled are right, have gotten their own way and IndyRef2 wont ever happen…..theres no legal route to it and the only party big enough to achieve it are in freefall…..

Im away to pin my Union Jack up in the hall, look out my blue tie and relearn the words to God Save the King! We are in for one hell of a ride under Rishi!

Post Edited (Fri 06 Oct 14:01)
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: Buspasspar  
Date:   Fri 6 Oct 16:28

I`m with Towks post @12.55 on this .. I too vote Snp and voted Yes in 2014 and would do so again .. would still love Alba to be an independent Country but its not going to happen .. At least not in my life time which saddens me

Jake please don`t waste your vote on the greens or independent or lib dems that is what the Tory`s want .. divide and conquer .. we need a strong labour vote again in Scotland to get shot of the vermin that have systematically ruined the UK
with their greed and corruption .. A vote for any other party is a vote for the Tory`s .. I am prepared to switch allegiance to try and get them out .. Then perhaps the SNP can regroup and mount a challenge again .. that is the reality for me



Post Edited (Fri 06 Oct 16:36)
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: Parboiled  
Date:   Fri 6 Oct 16:49

Eck has accounted for 86% of the voters. A load of crap from a rogue poll methinks.
Anyhoo, The other 14% don’t knows dinnae jump when the ballot box pencil is in their mitts ..hey presto, 55%!

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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: wee eck  
Date:   Fri 6 Oct 17:12

It was Tony Blair`s Foundation that conducted the poll, not me. If you follow the usual practice of excluding `don`t knows` you get 52 pc in favour of independence.

Whenever anyone tries to start a serious debate on here you try to shirk it with what you think is a smart answer or a random insult but it just demonstrates your reluctance or inability to discuss things in a mature way.
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: Tenruh  
Date:   Fri 6 Oct 18:54

Quote:

wee eck, Fri 6 Oct 17:12

It was Tony Blair`s Foundation that conducted the poll, not me. If you follow the usual practice of excluding `don`t knows` you get 52 pc in favour of independence.

Whenever anyone tries to start a serious debate on here you try to shirk it with what you think is a smart answer or a random insult but it just demonstrates your reluctance or inability to discuss things in a mature way.


It`s all about closing down debate Eck.
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: wee eck  
Date:   Fri 6 Oct 19:27

Well he won`t stop me debating.
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 Re: I beg to differ
Topic Originator: jake89  
Date:   Fri 6 Oct 21:00

Undecided who I`d vote for, bpp. Certainly wouldn`t ever be Tory and unlikely to be Labour. The Lib Dems in Dunfermline seem a decent bunch but I won`t vote for them whilst they`re led by a known misogynist bully. The Greens in Fife are a great bunch but, again, at a national level I`m not convinced.

That really brings it down to a hopeless SNP and an Alba party made up of weerdies.
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