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 Afghanistan
Topic Originator: jake89  
Date:   Mon 16 Aug 07:56

Not sure if this is for here or the politics forum.

What a mess. I've never understood why the west always try and push our approaches on the rest of the world then act surprised when it fails. China and Russia now recognising the Taliban and promising investment. I'd hope conflict can now end as is being promised, but I'd fully expect those in Afghanistan who supported the fight against the Taliban to be persecuted.
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 Re: Afghanistan
Topic Originator: ipswichpar  
Date:   Mon 16 Aug 08:37

Agree. A complete mess. They seemed to give up very easily so I suspect a full blown civil war once they reorganise.

Desperate scenes of people trying to climb onto planes to flee the country.
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 Re: Afghanistan
Topic Originator: Wotsit  
Date:   Mon 16 Aug 08:39

Trillions spent to achieve zero positive impact for Afghanistan.


"Who you are and what you feel comes not just from inside you, but from where you are in the power structure"
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 Re: Afghanistan
Topic Originator: jake89  
Date:   Mon 16 Aug 08:50

No doubt result in issues in Pakistan too.
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 Re: Afghanistan
Topic Originator: Buspasspar  
Date:   Mon 16 Aug 09:04

Russia, China and Iran ready to step in with investment

We are forever shaped by the Children we once were
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 Re: Afghanistan
Topic Originator: jake89  
Date:   Mon 16 Aug 10:19

Quote:

Buspasspar, Mon 16 Aug 09:04

Russia, China and Iran ready to step in with investment


Which is all political to annoy the USA.
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 Re: Afghanistan
Topic Originator: Stanza  
Date:   Mon 16 Aug 10:58

It's just another round in The Great Game that has been going on in the area for two centuries.
Unfortunately the women and girls will pay the price.

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 Re: Afghanistan
Topic Originator: Buspasspar  
Date:   Mon 16 Aug 12:09

From June this year:-

https://www.atlanticcouncil.org/blogs/new-atlanticist/how-russia-china-and-iran-will-shape-afghanistans-future/

We are forever shaped by the Children we once were
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 Re: Afghanistan
Topic Originator: Tenruh  
Date:   Mon 16 Aug 13:01

https://scheerpost.com/2021/07/26/hedges-the-collective-suicide-machine/

Slowly slowly catcha 🐒
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 Re: Afghanistan
Topic Originator: veteraneastender  
Date:   Mon 16 Aug 13:32

"Russia, China and Iran ready to step in with investment."

You would think Russia might be wary of Afghanistan, considering their relatively recent involvement there.

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 Re: Afghanistan
Topic Originator: sadindiefreak  
Date:   Mon 16 Aug 14:12

Quote:

veteraneastender, Mon 16 Aug 13:32

"Russia, China and Iran ready to step in with investment."

You would think Russia might be wary of Afghanistan, considering their relatively recent involvement there.


The Soviet Union would have defeated the Mujahideen had it not been for US support for them.
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 Re: Afghanistan
Topic Originator: sadindiefreak  
Date:   Mon 16 Aug 14:17

Quote:

Stanza, Mon 16 Aug 10:58

It's just another round in The Great Game that has been going on in the area for two centuries.
Unfortunately the women and girls will pay the price.


Atheists also. an Afghani who is in an atheist Facebook group I'm in posted a message saying goodbye as he expects to be executed.
We were all telling him just to pretend he is still Muslim but he says too many people know he is atheist so he won't last long even if he does.
Really sad.
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 Re: Afghanistan
Topic Originator: Tenruh  
Date:   Mon 16 Aug 14:40

Quote:

sadindiefreak, Mon 16 Aug 14:17

Quote:

Stanza, Mon 16 Aug 10:58

It's just another round in The Great Game that has been going on in the area for two centuries.
Unfortunately the women and girls will pay the price.


Atheists also. an Afghani who is in an atheist Facebook group I'm in posted a message saying goodbye as he expects to be executed.
We were all telling him just to pretend he is still Muslim but he says too many people know he is atheist so he won't last long even if he does.
Really sad.


That is horrendous for the guy
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 Re: Afghanistan
Topic Originator: Wotsit  
Date:   Mon 16 Aug 14:47

The Soviet puppet in Kabul outlasted ith USSR.

Pity the US didn't achieve something similar...


"Who you are and what you feel comes not just from inside you, but from where you are in the power structure"
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 Re: Afghanistan
Topic Originator: Buspasspar  
Date:   Mon 16 Aug 16:04

Topic Originator: Tenruh like | nolike
Date: Mon 16 Aug 13:01

https://scheerpost.com/2021/07/26/hedges-the-collective-suicide-machine/

Slowly slowly catcha 🐒


That is quite some read Tenruh .. thanks for sharing

We are forever shaped by the Children we once were
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 Re: Afghanistan
Topic Originator: sammer  
Date:   Tue 17 Aug 14:24

Tony Blair has been pretty free with his advice on matters like Brexit, the Labour Party leadership and Covid the past few years. He doesn`t seem to have said much about Afghanistan thus far which is odd since it is really his specialist subject.

sammer
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 Re: Afghanistan
Topic Originator: OzPar  
Date:   Tue 17 Aug 19:37


"https://scheerpost.com/2021/07/26/hedges-the-collective-suicide-machine/

Slowly slowly catcha 🐒"


I have watched quite a few of Chris Hedges` talks on YouTube in recent years. He is an interesting character and it is difficult to deny his conclusion that America, as a nation and an empire, is in rapid terminal decline.

It was always folly to invade an undefeated Afghanistan. History, geography and topography guarantee that war there is unwinnable.

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 Re: Afghanistan
Topic Originator: sadindiefreak  
Date:   Tue 17 Aug 22:40

Quote:

OzPar, Tue 17 Aug 19:37

"https://scheerpost.com/2021/07/26/hedges-the-collective-suicide-machine/

Slowly slowly catcha 🐒"


I have watched quite a few of Chris Hedges` talks on YouTube in recent years. He is an interesting character and it is difficult to deny his conclusion that America, as a nation and an empire, is in rapid terminal decline.

It was always folly to invade an undefeated Afghanistan. History, geography and topography guarantee that war there is unwinnable.


I like his politics apart from his abhorrent views towards atheists. Comparing atheists to religious extremists.
I've never heard of an atheist killing people because they are religious.
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 Re: Afghanistan
Topic Originator: sammer  
Date:   Wed 18 Aug 01:39

Here’s a photo of terror which many of you will have seen before. It’s not a pleasant photo so I can understand if you would rather look away. The terror is etched on the faces of young children who are running from a South Vietnamese bombing raid in 1972. The girl in the centre has had her clothes burned off by napalm and you can see the burns on her skin. That is what napalm is designed to do. She was nine years old and was heard shouting, `Too hot! Too hot!’ by the American soldiers who were attempting to shepherd them from the area. They poured water on her wounds but unsurprisingly she was scarred and partly maimed for life. I understand she is still alive, lives in Canada and has a family of her own. The girl on the far right of the photo, who presumably is protecting her younger brother, is the epitome of grace under fire.



I put the harrowing photo up tonight for two reasons. First of all, the attack on the children is not officially acknowledged as being an act of terror. (Richard Nixon, the US President of the time, even thought it might have been faked.) The term used then was ‘pacification.’ The same things are happening as I write, as a host of western journalists and politicians are screaming for Joe Biden to do a bit more of the same in Afghanistan, except now it’s called ‘counter insurgency’ or ‘nation building,’ or ‘protecting female rights.’ But you won’t see any photos like this now: all journalists and photographers are vetted and pooled. Even if they snapped such a shot it would not be carried in MSM. So for the record I am wrong. The children that day in 1972, or the girl in Plymouth who was running from a killer as she pushed a toy pram were frightened obviously, but these were not terrorist incidents. Official.

Which leads me to me second point. Why on earth should I listen to warmongers or their courtiers in the media as they stroke their chins and debate whether an act is ‘terrorist’ or not? The word has no meaning in their world of power politics so I will reserve my right to ignore it. Maybe time for the word ‘terrorism’, which I think has its origins in the French revolution, to be put in Trotsky’s overflowing dustbin of history along with all the other refuse. Let the political hyenas and jackals salvage from that what they can.

sammer
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 Re: Afghanistan
Topic Originator: sammer  
Date:   Wed 18 Aug 02:11

sadindiefreak,

It has happened certainly in the USSR. I like Hedges stuff but like you have reservations. However his over arching point is that science is as much a religion- faith based- as religion is. Jim Fraser`s son used to make that point well on this sight.

The failure to fully understand the Covid virus and how it spreads and mutates is evidence to support his case. We are subjected to a bunch of scientific high priests claiming some deeper knowledge that simply does not, at the moment, exist. Sweden should be depopulated by now. Or Australia should be Eldorada. Neither is true.

Hedges starts from a moral point of view and works towards economics whilst most western politicians do the opposite. Then they are stunned by the success of the Taliban. Hedges won`t be. He`s a Christian anarchist in the Tolstoy tradition , a bit like Ghandi maybe.

sammer
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 Re: Afghanistan
Topic Originator: OzPar  
Date:   Wed 18 Aug 04:43

I am not too familiar with his views on atheism, but in most other respects, I am impressed by Chris Hedges the man.

Perhaps less known is the work he does in the American prison system.

A fierce opponent of privatised prisons, Hedges has exposed how the enforced labour of prisoners has been manipulated to benefit some of the largest American brands. No need for Asian sweatshops, when you can just pop down to your local prison to get workers for a few cents an hour.

Hedges has voluntarily taught university and college-credit courses in a maximum-security prison in New Jersey and has even got his hardened crim students to write a very good play about mass incarceration, called `Caged`.

As a footnote to Afghanistan, I will be looking out for the comments of George Galloway.

He has lots of critics, but no one in the West has come close to painting a more accurate picture of how the Arab/Muslim world thinks and acts. His comments over the years on the Mujahideen and its spawn, the Taliban, have been prescient, to say the least.

Another voice worth listening to on this subject is the ex-MP Rory Stewart.

He did an excellent documentary of Britain`s long history with Afghanistan a few years ago, called `The Great Game`. His viewpoint will be valuable.

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