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Topic Originator: veteraneastender
Date: Wed 3 Sep 09:07
I see Starmer is advocating digital ID cards - long overdue I reckon.
The benefits are a no brainer IMO.
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Topic Originator: sadindiefreak
Date: Wed 3 Sep 12:17
Quote:
veteraneastender, Wed 3 Sept 09:07
I see Starmer is advocating digital ID cards - long overdue I reckon.
The benefits are a no brainer IMO.
Name one benefit of ID cards that a passport or driving licence doesn`t already provide.
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Topic Originator: jake89
Date: Wed 3 Sep 12:37
Quote:
sadindiefreak, Wed 3 Sept 12:17
Quote:
veteraneastender, Wed 3 Sept 09:07
I see Starmer is advocating digital ID cards - long overdue I reckon.
The benefits are a no brainer IMO.
Name one benefit of ID cards that a passport or driving licence doesn`t already provide.
For a start, neither of those are digital IDs, though I suppose a passport is to some degree due to the associated biometrics.
For me, the benefit would be flexibility. No need for paper/plastic.
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Topic Originator: DBP
Date: Wed 3 Sep 13:27
…And a quick Google will give you multiple reasons why I’ll be saying no to carrying a digital ID
Post Edited (Wed 03 Sep 14:12)
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Topic Originator: AdamAntsParsStripe
Date: Wed 3 Sep 16:07
I suppose the obvious answer is that not everyone has a passport or/and a drivers license.
I don’t see an issue having lived in Germany where it is mandatory like most Euro countries to have one.
Zwei Pints Bier und ein Päckchen Chips bitte
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Topic Originator: sadindiefreak
Date: Wed 3 Sep 16:16
In 2009 when this was last proposed the London School of Economics estimated the cost would be 18 billion.
There would be no requirement to carry an id card, or to produce one on demand.
Any small benefit in making things easier for people with no passport or driving licence to apply for stuff is far outweighed by the cost. A cost which will now be more than 18 billion.
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Topic Originator: veteraneastender
Date: Wed 3 Sep 16:24
"Name one benefit of ID cards that a passport or driving licence doesn`t already provide."
Passports and Driving Licences are not compulsory and even if possessed there is no requirement to carry them.
An ID card would allow passengers to fly on domestic flights without the need for a passport etc.
Also when opening a bank account or taking a credit agreement the card would satisfy ID requirements.
In the UK they would solve a problem for police when wiseguy law breakers claim to have no identification.
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Topic Originator: sadindiefreak
Date: Wed 3 Sep 22:42
Quote:
veteraneastender, Wed 3 Sept 16:24
"Name one benefit of ID cards that a passport or driving licence doesn`t already provide."
Passports and Driving Licences are not compulsory and even if possessed there is no requirement to carry them.
If it`s the same as proposed in 2009, there was to be no requirement to carry an ID card and no obligation to show an ID card
An ID card would allow passengers to fly on domestic flights without the need for a passport etc.
You can already use a driving licence, plus it`s always a good idea to use a passport when flying domestically incase of diversions, as happened recently when planes were diverted to mainland Europe, those travellers without passports couldn`t leave the airport, same would be true with ID card.
Also when opening a bank account or taking a credit agreement the card would satisfy ID requirements.
So does passport and drivers licence, even without those a birth certificate and 3 months of utility bills sent to your address can get you a bank account, which can then get you a credit agreement if you show you have funds, which would be required anyway with an ID card
In the UK they would solve a problem for police when wiseguy law breakers claim to have no identification.
As I said before, there will be no obligation to carry it and no right for anyone to demand to see it, police included.
The minute numbers who might benefit from this does not justify a bill of £18billion plus.
Post Edited (Wed 03 Sep 22:43)
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Topic Originator: jake89
Date: Thu 4 Sep 00:33
I`ve set up various bank accounts digitally.
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Topic Originator: Dandy Warhol
Date: Thu 4 Sep 07:38
I called this, use the migrant situation to bring in digital id for all of us. Think about it, your id cancelled if deemed to say a hurty word.
I don`t wanna go down like disco.
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Topic Originator: veteraneastender
Date: Thu 4 Sep 12:07
If (operative word) implemented I would expect it to compulsory as in most other countries, otherwise it becomes pointless.
As for the £18 billion figure - that sounds like creative accounting ? Based on a population of 65 million that works out around £275 per person !!!
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Topic Originator: NewPoster2024
Date: Thu 4 Sep 12:30
I think people are really overplaying this, to a decent extent based upon a misunderstanding of how something like this works (belief that it involves one vast centralised database that has all of your information), stupid conspiracy theories or based upon wild cost estimates.
Sweden has a system called `BankID`, which isn`t run by the government, but is basically used for every public service or website in the country (mainly because of how much it simplifies everything). It was set-up and paid for by the banks. I doubt the banks in a country of 10 million would`ve borne the costs of £18 Billion happily.
It works by simply validating your physical identity document using an app, or by visiting a bank branch and having someone there validate it. The app then only really has a photograph of you, your date of birth, and a unique identifier for you - in Sweden this is a NI number (which is public in Sweden, so not an additional risk).
When you then need to show ID, you can just load the app and show it.
When you want to log on to your GP, or to a government website, the login page asks you to scan a QR code. You open the app, click the QR code button and scan it. The website is then given your unique identifier. If that unique identifier exists in their records, then they can pull up your account.
Likewise, if you want to log in to your online broadband account, or online shopping - you do the same. You scan the QR code. If you don`t have an account, the website uses your unique identifier to access publicly available records and pull up your address (in the same way companies here can access the electoral roll), then the entire account is set-up within seconds.
It makes life much much easier. There`s no messing around with usernames or passwords. You have an app on your phone, and you scan it to access all your accounts, or show it to prove ID.
Denmark has a similar system called MitID, which is run by the government.
This sort of thing is the future.
Post Edited (Thu 04 Sep 12:44)
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Topic Originator: jake89
Date: Thu 4 Sep 16:19
We already have similar solutions in Scotland. However, the difference is it`s completely optional, and also not well adopted. There are companies out there who specialise in personal data stores where you can have all your data and ID and choose when, who and what parts you want to share. So you could be sharing your name, address and DOB with your bank while sharing the same plus medical notes with your carer. It removes duplication and ensures the latest information is available.
People will always worry what is stored in databases about them. Quite right too when the likes of the supercomputer in Edinburgh will be a prime hacking target. However, everything is a risk and 99% of us are pretty dull people with little worth knowing.
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Topic Originator: NewPoster2024
Date: Thu 4 Sep 17:33
That`s the sort of misunderstanding I`m talking about. You`ve brought up the idea of a centralised database that contains all your information, and then said that people are rightly concerned about such an idea. That`s despite that not being the idea (nor being how the system I brought up as an example works).
(As an aside, though, the idea that your data is inherently safer being controlled by thousands of small GP practices, your local council, and a mishmash of other agencies, is not a given. If anything, larger organisations - such as banks - can afford to pay for much better expertise).
The idea behind a digital ID is more of a way of digitally being able to identify yourself. That can be used to identify you, without needing to carry around an ID card. It can also be used - if you choose - to identify yourself to a website or app, and then that site or app can then use that information to pull any particularly sensitive information about you from their own databases.
I think this discussion is an example of one of the reasons why the UK is falling behind a lot of other countries in terms of public services and economic growth. Too often any innovation, or any ideas, are immediately criticised until they don`t happen.
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Topic Originator: Luxembourg Par
Date: Sat 6 Sep 18:22
The digital ID works very well in Lux too.
Government services are very much online, as are banking , health, social security, taxation, driving licenses, et al.
The problem isn’t ID - digital or physical.
The problem is that people in UK have zero faith in the government to not
1. Protect the data properly
2. slowly insist that it becomes mandatory to obtain banking, health services, then everything else - instead of just making access easier.
3. Then progress to mandatory production of ID on demand.
Will then be used to monitor and control the people, and likely these new ID cards will be handed out willy-nilly to all the illegals flooding in, avoiding the need to properly review and process asylum claims.
Just because you call something a conspiracy theory, doesn’t mean it’s not gonna happen…
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